Wikipedia:Education noticeboard

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This page is for discussion of items that relate to student assignments and the Wikipedia Education Program. Please feel free to post, whether you're from a class, a potential class, or if you're a Wikipedia editor.

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Of course, we should remain civil towards all participants and assume good faith.

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See also
  • Special:Courses (a list of courses using the Education Program extension)

Copy-paste merging versus history-merging

Followup to the already archived Wikipedia:Education noticeboard/Archive 16#Proposal for update in the student instructions for moving drafts into mainspace. See Wikipedia talk:Merging#When to request a histmerge. You might consider making the archiving of this page a little less aggressive, so I'm not forced to create a fork of a discussion that's less than a month old. – wbm1058 (talk) 15:59, 27 May 2017 (UTC)

@Wbm1058: 7 days is rather aggressive, isn't it. I think that's a hold-over from when course announcements were all posted here rather than a subpage, making the page fairly unwieldy when not archived frequently. I've changed it to 30 days -- we'll see how that works. And thanks for the link. I'll take a look at this on Monday, but wanted to comment that this is definitely something we want to spend time on this summer, revising training materials prior to the fall 2017 courses starting. I've added DNAU to this thread to ensure it's here at that time. Also want to ping Shalor (Wiki Ed), the content expert working with that class in particular. --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 17:29, 27 May 2017 (UTC)

See also Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/688809 Memory/Archive. We need adequate notice of student editing, and course instructors shouldn't be assigning the task of writing multiple content forks of the same topic, leaving it for overworked volunteers to clean up. – wbm1058 (talk) 12:22, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

I apologise for dropping the ball on that one, I started preparing the page about the course but didn't share it on the announcement noticeboard. Advance notice of editing would certainly have helped, but the students' accounts remain blocked. Please could the blocks be lifted? Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 12:29, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
I don't think just an announcement on a noticeboard is sufficient. Most editors are not monitoring these noticeboards. There should be some indication on the editor's user or user talk page, such as Template:Student editor (e.g., like this). It should link to their assignment, so we can see what their objective is. wbm1058 (talk) 12:48, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
Note how Wikipedia:Wiki Ed/Rutgers University/Languages in Peril Section II (Spring 2017) lists each student in the class, along with the titles of the Wikipedia articles that they are working on.
Wikipedia:Outreach Dashboard/Swansea University/LAA319 - Competition Law doesn't have a similar list of students and articles. – wbm1058 (talk) 12:53, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
OK, I see that course runs until 28 June 2017. Can these closely related articles either be merged, or clearly differentiated using WP:summary style so that it's clear they are not forks covering the same topic? wbm1058 (talk) 13:18, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
Just to comment on noticeboard announcements, though wbm1058 has since clarified that's not necessarily the question here, I don't think there's a formal process for announcing Education Program classes in general. Wikipedia:Education noticeboard/Wiki Ed course submissions is a page of notices automatically (or semi-automatically) generated by the Wiki Ed Dashboard), but I don't think WMF has incorporated an equivalent into the Programs and Events Dashboard (classes outside the US/CA), so the best way to stay up on that would probably be to keep tabs on the Dashboard itself. --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 12:51, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
Btw, Wbm1058, I don't know if you saw this, but from the page you linked you can click the "Dashboard" link at the top and then go to the "students" tab to see the list of students and assigned articles (though it looks like most have not added an article yet -- perhaps that's what you mean). --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 13:32, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
Thanks, no I didn't find that until you pointed it out. But there I see "Assignment End: 2017-05-10", so it's not clear to me whether the course is still active, and whether the students will return to editing if their accounts are unlocked. Sockpuppet investigations isn't an area I'm active in administratively, so I'm unclear on proper procedures for reopening an investigation and unblocking editors... if we can wait on User:Bbb23 to do it then I'm sure it will be done the right way. – wbm1058 (talk) 13:43, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • I'll keep an eye on students doing this. This summer we're going to be working on refining some of our handouts and instructions, so this will definitely be something we look at. :) Shalor (Wiki Ed) (talk) 12:55, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • Frankly, folks, Wiki Ed drives me crazy. You have no idea how many cases are brought to WP:SPI from which, understandably, blocks ensue and then along comes someone to say, oh, these are students. How are we supposed to know that? There should be a clear notice on their userpage as to who they are and a link to the program. It would be better for you, the students, and the various unsuspecting editors at Wikipedia who become involved. I'm not going to spontaneously look at a Wiki Ed venue every time I evaluate a case. Unless you start cleaning up your procedures, this won't be the last time this happens. I will unblock the four accounts and remove the sock tags from their userpages (no need to reopen the case). Someone else can deal with the undeleting of any pages that were deleted. BTW, Richard, you should not have edited the SPI archive. Instead, you should have gone to Wbm1058, to me, or to an SPI clerk to make your request. I'm sure Wiki Ed is a lot of work and you, of course, provide a valuable service to Wikipedia and to the outside community, so I apologize for being, uh, brusque.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:22, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • @Bbb23: Every class working with Wiki Ed (the Wiki Education Foundation) should have a list of students on the course page, a tag on every student's user page, and a tag on the articles they work on (there are some exceptions to the latter based on the way sandboxes are handled). I think that you're probably talking about the parts of the Education Program that aren't Wiki Ed? That seems like it could be addressed by incorporating the templating procedures into the P&E Dashboard. @Sage (Wiki Ed): who is the best person to ask about that at WMF (or otherwise)? --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 14:41, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • If the P&E Dashboard was set up to automatically create a page on-wiki listing editors involved that would be very helpful. Currently it has to be manually set up which relies on my (very much fallible) memory. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 15:41, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • @Ryan (Wiki Ed): Are you saying that this program with these users was not part of Wiki Ed?--Bbb23 (talk) 14:45, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • @Bbb23: The Wiki Education Foundation ("Wiki Ed" for short) manages the Wikipedia Education Program for institutions in the United States and Canada. WMF manages the Education Program elsewhere, along with various chapters. --Ryan (Wiki Ed) (talk) 14:50, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • Ah, I'll try to remember that. And here I thought the only Foundation I had to bitch about was the WMF. A new target for my irritation.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:59, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
  • I see that m:Education is a disambiguation page. It would be nice, and less confusing for unaffiliated, independent editors and administrators, if the Wikipedia Education Program, a program of Wikimedia Outreach (why is that page tagged as "historical" if the Education Program still uses their logo and Outreach has its own wiki?), had all of their chapters, including WMUK, using the same standards and procedures developed by the Wiki Education Foundation, which I presume is no longer a proposed Wikimedia thematic organization, as the disambiguation page still claims? wbm1058 (talk) 15:45, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
@Bbb23: WikiEd haven't done anything wrong here (and do an excellent job) this course is under my auspices rather than theirs. I agree that student accounts should include a note on their user page that they are taking part in an educational course and I will make sure that happens. Thank you for taking the time to unblock the accounts. I apologise for the extra work this has created and appreciate that it is taking up your volunteer time. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 15:39, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
@Richard Nevell (WMUK): Not to worry, many of my comments are tongue-in-cheek, although I have had some negative experiences in the past. This is the first time I've learned something useful, i.e., the division of responsibility. Happy teaching.--Bbb23 (talk) 15:44, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
@Bbb23: Yes, there are different hubs of activity. For future courses (not just this one but others I'm involved) I'll be making sure students have a notice on their user page and on talk pages as Ryan said is compulsory for WikiEd courses. Currently I recommend it for courses WMUK assists, but it should be a requirement rather than a recommendation. Please could 826540MAH (talk · contribs) 838181CDC (talk · contribs) 838463swanseauni (talk · contribs) Elinahh (talk · contribs) Nfyfe826276 (talk · contribs) also be unblocked? Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 16:00, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
 Done.--Bbb23 (talk) 16:37, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
An important responsibility for any class assignment, no matter which program advises it, is to put Template:Educational assignment on the talk page of every article being worked on. That's the first and foremost way to let other editors know that these are student editors, and not something else. Then, as also mentioned above, students should put Template:Student editor on their own userpages – and of course there should be a course page that clearly identifies the instructor. These steps can go a long way towards preventing such problems as mistaking student edits for socking, and also help a lot with keeping communication open with other editors. I think that all programs that work with student assignments should try to make these things clear to all classes they work with. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:27, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

Automatic edits from Programs & Events Dashboard

@Richard Nevell (WMUK), Wbm1058, Bbb23, and Ryan (Wiki Ed): I'm currently mentoring User:Medhabansal for an internship project to enable edits from Programs & Events Dashboard, which would let us enable some of the edits that the Wiki Ed Dashboard makes on a wiki-by-wiki basis. The project just started, but hopefully within the next few months we can have the automatically-updated course pages and the userpage templates like for Wiki Ed courses. --Sage (Wiki Ed) (talk) 16:58, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

That's a very encouraging development. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 15:14, 7 June 2017 (UTC)

Required classwork

User:Dawson - jennifer tells me that she is required to create a particular article for a class, but her draft is redundant to End-of-life care. Can someone with more experience with the education program guide her? Thanks. --SarekOfVulcan (talk) 16:50, 24 April 2018 (UTC)

Hi @SarekOfVulcan: It looks like this student is in a course in West Africa (the college appears to be Ashesi University). I'll ping the WMF Education team, @TFlanagan-WMF, VMasrour (WMF), and NSaad (WMF):, who might be able to put her in touch with program participants in that geographic area. Cassidy (Wiki Ed) (talk) 17:26, 24 April 2018 (UTC)
This relates to the issue I raised above (see Ashesi University College). A great number of students from this university have begun editing in similarly problematic fashion. I have attempted to communicate with some of the students to ascertain the user ID of their teacher, to no avail. WikiDan61ChatMe!ReadMe!! 18:23, 24 April 2018 (UTC)
Thanks for the notice. We're finding out who we need to contact there. VMasrour (WMF) (talk) 21:19, 24 April 2018 (UTC)
Flixtey, do you know these students? Can you reach out to them? NSaad (WMF) (talk) 12:17, 27 April 2018 (UTC)

Another seemingly unregistered class

See Draft:The Fog (Mad Men), this comment, and the edit summary here. Probably also responsible for Six Month Leave given similar structure, and possibly also Three Sundays on the same general topic. ansh666 18:32, 25 April 2018 (UTC)

Oh yeah, students: Joshua Larmon (talk · contribs) and possibly Amiajmeri98 (talk · contribs) and Thechelsssjamesss (talk · contribs). ansh666 18:35, 25 April 2018 (UTC)
See also Lorikuns (talk · contribs), who claimed to be working on a Mad Men article for a school project]. —C.Fred (talk) 18:49, 25 April 2018 (UTC)
  • Thanks! I think I've discovered the professor and we'll reach out to them about signing up with Wiki Education. Shalor (Wiki Ed) (talk) 16:55, 26 April 2018 (UTC)
    Thank you! ansh666 07:11, 27 April 2018 (UTC)

Student unfairly blocked, needs an unblock

Some editors here may be interested in reviewing how a case of a new student editor being blocked is being handled: Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Student_unfairly_blocked,_needs_an_unblock. (Hint: I am not impressed, IMHO it's a major WP:BITE and I am really disappointed how many people are in favor of BITING newbies...). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 10:32, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Myself, I never want to see a student editor, acting in good faith, have a bad experience as a result of a class editing project. But after looking over what happened, I see a significant missed opportunity. Better guidance from the instructor about how to edit, before the editing began, could have averted the entire situation. I know the WikiEd staff do excellent work in reaching out to instructors and trying to offer assistance, but if the instructor does not take seriously the obligation that they have to their own students, it's the students who wind up with the short end of the stick. --Tryptofish (talk) 17:19, 30 April 2018 (UTC)
As Tryptofish says, that is usually the problem. Any other editor would end up blocked in such a case. With all the problems caused by poorly instructed student editors, it is not apparent to me that blocking them is unfair. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 17:27, 30 April 2018 (UTC)
Wiki Education isn't involved in this course; Piotr teaches in Korea and is thus outside our support region. But speaking personally: I have worked with Piotr for many years; he's a longtime Wikipedian who taught with our program when he was in the U.S. and was instrumental in helping us design many of our support resources. He's been teaching with Wikipedia for a decade, and helped write much of the original WP:SUP guidelines. I really respect his knowledge and expertise, and I don't think it's fair to assume he didn't provide good guidance or poorly instructed his students. The reality is that not every student learns the same way, and a situation where there is excellent instruction and good faith student editors can still result in students making mistakes. Instructors like Piotr who patiently help students learn from their mistakes are the best teachers, and I hope we can all recognize that's what he's trying to do here. --LiAnna (Wiki Ed) (talk) 23:21, 30 April 2018 (UTC)
This is entirely my fault, but I didn't pick up on the fact that he was the instructor when I wrote my earlier comment, sorry. I certainly do realize (and in fact know from my own experiences teaching) that students sometimes simply don't follow the instruction they have been given. In this particular case, though, it looks like it went on long enough before the block that the student should have touched base with the instructor, having in fact gone to the Teahouse. In any case, it is all too common that other instructors fail to adequately prepare their students. And it is very important to realize that Wikipedia editors are not responsible for looking out for the students' learning experiences. It's very nice if an editor chooses to do so, but otherwise, student editors should be treated the same as other new editors, no better and no worse. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:37, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Related AN/I discussion

Could someone take a look at this discussion? Thanks! and sorry to bug you all so much over small things... ansh666 19:45, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

Apparent project not coordinating

I've just had a helpee come in on Wikipedia-en-help on IRC, and he tells me that he's working on a class project that isn't coordinating with SUP. Quoth him, "It's czech univercity in prague, BIE-EHD subject and the teacher is Mr. Evan" [sic]. Is there any way to both verify this is indeed legitimate and maybe reach out to them or the students? —Jeremy v^_^v Bori! 10:06, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

@Vojtěch Dostál and Gabriela Boková (WMCZ): Can you help? --LiAnna (Wiki Ed) (talk) 20:34, 18 May 2018 (UTC)
Looks like this one. I don't known what SUP is but we'll try contacting them --Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 21:05, 18 May 2018 (UTC)
WP:SUP, for reference. —Jeremy v^_^v Bori! 00:48, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
Thanks Jeremy :) --Vojtěch Dostál (talk) 12:50, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Campus Ambassador application: oishik0412

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Oishik0412 (talk · contribs)

  1. Why do you want to be a Wikipedia Ambassador?
    Sir, I'm very curious to start my career as early as possible and I find everything best about this organisation like it's growth and work environment. Being a fresher I don't have any experience and I need a platform to prove my knowledge and skills. I'm more focused on achieving success in my career than making money. It will also give a great start to my career.
  2. Where are you based, and which educational institution(s) do you plan to work with as a Campus Ambassador?
    I am based in Bhubaneswar and I plan to work with KIIT University.
  3. What is your academic and/or professional background?
    I hold a good academic background.
  4. In three sentences or less, summarize your prior experience with Wikimedia projects.
  5. What else should we know about you that is relevant to being a Wikipedia Ambassador?
    I am currently a campus ambassador for three organizations. They are WERP-India, Couponbaazar and Y4D Foundation. I hold good record in the field of cultural and sports activities.
Not done per the very large banner at the top of this page. — xaosflux Talk 10:40, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

@Xaosflux:, Which large banner? Cheers · · · Peter (Southwood) (talk): 11:23, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

@Pbsouthwood: click edit again, then look up to this. — xaosflux Talk 11:26, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
@Xaosflux:, If you mean the notice with the animated stop sign, I see it, but it is not immediately obvious that it refers to the above application. Cheers, · · · Peter (Southwood) (talk): 11:55, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
@Pbsouthwood: I expanded it to be explicit, thanks for the note. — xaosflux Talk 12:03, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
That should help, time will tell. Cheers, · · · Peter (Southwood) (talk): 13:00, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
I looked at the edit notice with this specific issue in mind, and it seems to me that it might be further modified to get the message across. It starts with the note about the module being removed, which I think will make most newbies tune out before they get to the next sentence. I recommend changing it to:
No new applications for group memberships (Course coordinators, Course campus volunteers, Course instructors, Course online volunteers, Campus ambassadors) should be submitted. The "courses" module is being removed (phab:T125618) along with the user groups associated with it. Thank you.
That puts the main message first, and in bold. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:17, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
Updated. — xaosflux Talk 18:38, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
Thanks, but I think you put the wrong part in bold. --Tryptofish (talk) 18:42, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
Oops, fixed - actually I caused a LintError too! — xaosflux Talk 01:27, 26 May 2018 (UTC)
Thanks! It looks good now! --Tryptofish (talk) 16:33, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

Literacy and Social Justice

Several of the page creations from Santa Clara's "Literacy and Social Justice" class ([1]) are broadly problematic. @Shalor (Wiki Ed): any thoughts? power~enwiki (π, ν) 03:58, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

  • I'll take a look and see what I can do about the pages. Shalor (Wiki Ed) (talk) 13:22, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Class that may need contact

I just came across Wikipedia:WikiProject AP Biology 2018. It seems to be operating outside of the system. Also, they should not be calling themselves a WikiProject, because that's not what they are. --Tryptofish (talk) 18:12, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

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