Template talk:Did you know

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For instructions on how to nominate an article, see below.
"Did you know...?"
Discussion WT:DYK
Rules WP:DYK
Supplementary rules WP:DYKSG
Noms (awaiting approval) WP:DYKN
Reviewing guide WP:DYKR
Noms (approved) WP:DYKNA
Preps & Queues T:DYK/Q
Currently on Main Page
Main Page errors WP:ERRORS
Archive of DYKs WP:DYKA
April 1 hooks WP:DYKAPRIL
April 1 talk WT:DYKAPRIL

This page is to nominate fresh articles to appear in the "Did you know" section on the Main Page, by a "hook" (an interesting note). Nominations that have been approved are moved to a staging area, from which the articles are promoted into the Queue.


Count of DYK Hooks
Section # of Hooks # Verified
August 7 1
August 17 1
August 31 1
September 6 1
September 12 1
September 18 1
September 20 1
September 22 1
September 23 2
September 25 1
September 26 1
September 27 3 1
October 2 3
October 3 2
October 4 1 1
October 5 1
October 6 2 1
October 7 5 3
October 8 6 2
October 9 3 1
October 10 6 3
October 11 4 1
October 12 4 3
October 13 2 1
October 14 7 3
October 15 3 1
October 16 9 6
October 17 6 5
October 18 4 1
October 19 3 3
October 20 6 6
October 21 6 3
October 22 9 7
October 23 6 3
October 24 6 3
October 25 11 8
October 26 10 9
October 27 7 5
October 28 8 7
October 29 8 8
October 30 12 10
October 31 11 7
November 1 10 8
November 2 9 6
November 3 11 9
November 4 12 7
November 5 14 9
November 6 7 4
November 7 9 6
November 8 11 3
November 9 11 4
November 10 7 5
November 11 8 3
November 12 8 5
November 13 4 3
November 14 9 4
November 15 15 6
November 16 2 1
November 17 18 6
November 18 9 6
November 19 7 2
November 20 7 3
November 21 1 1
November 22 1
Total 376 213
Last updated 11:04, 22 November 2018 UTC
Current time is 11:09, 22 November 2018 UTC [refresh]

Instructions for nominators

Create a subpage for your new DYK suggestion and then list the page below under the date the article was created or the expansion began or it became a good article (not the date you submit it here), with the newest dates at the bottom. Any registered user may nominate a DYK suggestion (if you are not a registered user, please leave a message at the bottom of the DYK project talk page with the details of the article you would like to nominate and the hook you would like to propose); self-nominations are permitted and encouraged. Thanks for participating and please remember to check back for comments on your nomination (consider watchlisting your nomination page).

If this is your first nomination, please read the DYK rules before continuing:
Official DYK criteria: DYK rules and supplementary guidelines
Unofficial guide: Learning DYK

To nominate an article

Read these instructions completely before proceeding.
For simplified instructions, see User:Rjanag/Quick DYK 2.
Create the nomination subpage.

Enter the article title in the box below and click the button. (To nominate multiple articles together, enter any or all of the article titles.) You will then be taken to a preloaded nomination page.

Write the nomination.

On the nomination page, fill in the relevant information. See Template:NewDYKnomination and {{NewDYKnomination/guide}} for further information.

  • Not every line of the template needs to be filled in. For instance, if you are not nominating an image to appear with your hook, there is no need to fill in the image-related lines.
  • Add an edit summary e.g. "Nominating YOUR ARTICLE TITLE for DYK" and click Save page.
  • Make sure the nomination page is on your watchlist, so you can follow the review discussion.

In the current nominations section find the subsection for the date on which the article was created or on which expansion began (or, if a new Good Article, the date on which it became a GA), not the date on which you make the nomination.

  • At the top of that subsection (before other nominations already there, but below the section head and hidden comment) add {{Did you know nominations/YOUR ARTICLE TITLE}}.
  • Add an edit summary e.g. "Nominating YOUR ARTICLE TITLE for DYK" and click Save page.
  • Consider adding {{Did you know nominations/YOUR ARTICLE TITLE}} to the article's talk page (without a section heading‍—‌the template adds a section heading automatically).

How to review a nomination

Any editor who was not involved in writing/expanding or nominating an article may review it by checking to see that the article meets all the DYK criteria (long enough, new enough, no serious editorial or content issues) and the hook is cited. Editors may also alter the suggested hook to improve it, suggest new hooks, or even lend a hand and make edits to the article to which the hook applies so that the hook is supported and accurate. For a more detailed discussion of the DYK rules and review process see the supplementary guidelines and the WP:Did you know/Reviewing guide.

To post a comment or review on a DYK nomination, follow the steps outlined below:

  • Look through this page, Template talk:Did you know, to find a nomination you would like to comment on.
  • Click the "Review or comment" link at the top of the nomination. You will be taken to the nomination subpage.
  • The top of the page includes a list of the DYK criteria. Check the article to ensure it meets all the relevant criteria.
  • To indicate the result of the review (i.e., whether the nomination passes, fails, or needs some minor changes), leave a signed comment on the page. Please begin with one of the 5 review symbols that appear at the top of the edit screen, and then indicate all aspects of the article that you have reviewed; your comment should look something like the following:

    Article length and age are fine, no copyvio or plagiarism concerns, reliable sources are used. But the hook needs to be shortened.

    If you are the first person to comment on the nomination, there will be a line :* <!-- REPLACE THIS LINE TO WRITE FIRST COMMENT, KEEPING :* --> showing you where you should put the comment.
  • Save the page.

If there is any problem or concern about a nomination, please consider notifying the nominator by placing {{subst:DYKproblem|Article|header=yes|sig=yes}} on the nominator's talk page.

Frequently asked questions


This page is often backlogged. As long as your submission is still on the page, it will stay there until an editor reviews it. Since editors are encouraged to review the oldest submissions first (so that those hooks don't grow stale), it may take several weeks until your submission is reviewed. In the meantime, please consider reviewing another submission (not your own) to help reduce the backlog (see instructions above).

Where is my hook?

If you can't find the nomination you submitted to this nominations page, it may have been approved and is on the approved nominations page waiting to be promoted. It could also have been added to one of the prep areas, promoted from prep to a queue, or is on the main page.

If the nominated hook is in none of those places, then the nomination has probably been rejected. Such a rejection usually only occurs if it was at least a couple of weeks old and had unresolved issues for which any discussion had gone stale. If you think your nomination was unfairly rejected, you can query this on the DYK discussion page, but as a general rule such nominations will only be restored in exceptional circumstances.

Search archived DYK nomination discussions

Instructions for other editors

How to promote an accepted hook

  • See Wikipedia:Did you know/Preparation areas for full instructions.
  • Hooks that have been approved are located on the approved nominations page.
  • In one window, open the DYK nomination subpage of the hook you would like to promote.
  • In another window, open the prep set you intend to add the hook to.
  • In the prep set...
    • Paste the hook into the hook area (be sure to not paste in that that)
    • Paste the credit information ({{DYKmake}} and/or {{DYKnom}}) into the credits area.
    • Add an edit summary, e.g. "Promoted [[Jane Fonda]]", preview, and save
  • Back on DYK nomination page...
    • change {{DYKsubpage to {{subst:DYKsubpage
    • change |passed= to |passed=yes
    • Add an edit summary, e.g. "Promoted to Prep 3", preview, and save

How to remove a rejected hook

  • Open the DYK nomination subpage of the hook you would like to remove. (It's best to wait several days after a reviewer has rejected the hook, just in case someone contests or the article undergoes a large change.)
  • In the window where the DYK nomination subpage is open, replace the line {{DYKsubpage with {{subst:DYKsubpage, and replace |passed= with |passed=no. Then save the page. This has the effect of wrapping up the discussion on the DYK nomination subpage in a blue archive box and stating that the nomination was unsuccessful, as well as adding the nomination to a category for archival purposes.

How to remove a hook from the prep areas or queue

  • Edit the prep area or queue where the hook is and remove the hook and the credits associated with it.
  • Go to the hook's nomination subpage (there should have been a link to it in the credits section).
    • View the edit history for that page
    • Go back to the last version before the edit where the hook was promoted, and revert to that version to make the nomination active again.
    • Add a new icon on the nomination subpage to cancel the previous tick and leave a comment after it explaining that the hook was removed from the prep area or queue, and why, so that later reviewers are aware of this issue.
  • Add a transclusion of the template back to this page so that reviewers can see it. It goes under the date that it was first created/expanded/listed as a GA. You may need to add back the day header for that date if it had been removed from this page.
  • If you removed the hook from a queue, it is best to either replace it with another hook from one of the prep areas, or to leave a message at WT:DYK asking someone else to do so.

How to move a nomination subpage to a new name

  • Don't; it should not ever be necessary, and will break some links which will later need to be repaired. Even if you change the title of the article, you don't need to move the nomination page.


Older nominations

Articles created/expanded on August 7

Lula Mysz-Gmeiner

Lula Mysz-Gmeiner
Lula Mysz-Gmeiner

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 19:52, 14 August 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg New, long enough, within policy (the PD copyright templating needed a bit of supplementing at Commons), QPQ done. The red links for two pianists are acceptable for DYK. But the hook should be changed from plural "Lieder" to singular "Lied", since that's what the Meier source says. Also, the redirect from double-s Transsylvania is not so nice. I propose ALT1:
This would be ready with ALT1. Boud (talk) 22:23, 1 September 2018 (UTC) OK with ALT1? Boud (talk) 22:31, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
  • Thank you for the review and the changes to the commons! - While ALT1 is correct, it misses that several composers dedicated Lieder (plural) to her which she often premiered, - it sounds like exactly one. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:46, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
ps: {{ill}} links are no red links, and are accepted on any level of Wikipedia. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:48, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
For the plural: "Für ihre Liederabende arbeitete Lula Mysz-Gmeiner untter anderem mit Max Reger, Franz Schreker, Eduard Behm, Emil Mattiesen und Richard Strauss zusammen. Ersterer widmete ihr genau wie Emil Mattiesen mehrere Lieder. Lula Mysz-Gmeiner sang mehrere Uraufführungen ..." - So Reger and Matthiessen dedicated several songs to her, and she sang several premieres. - It happens that a different singer than the dedicatee sings the premiere, but I'd say rarely. To be safe we could say:
--Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:00, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
  • You're right that the red links are inter-language links - I didn't mean to say they're not normally accepted, but rather that DYK, GA, FA require successively higher standards, and I gave a link to WP:DYKNOT which says that red links are fine in DYK - which presumably means that tl:ill, which are a good step better than red links, are even more acceptable. :) Boud (talk) 10:23, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
Regarding the assumption that a a dedicatee sings a premiere, or even that she necessarily sings a song dedicated to her: even though this is a reasonable educated guess, odd things do sometimes happen (e.g. a singer might suddenly die before s/he gets a chance to sing the song; might have a personal crisis or political disagreement with the composer and refuse to sing the songs). Maybe you can point to a specific place in Meier that justifies ALT2, but for the moment I propose ALT3. I removed "and others" because this is bit vague - WP:WEASEL doesn't state this particular example, though the WP:WHATPLACE subsection comes close in terms of what rather than who. I don't think putting a tl:ill would look good in the DYK hook, so including Emil Mattiesen there does not seem like a good option to me.
How about ALT3? Adding the reasonable (but AFAIK not strictly sourced as a fact) expectation that she sung all of the Lieder dedicated to her is not really likely to convince more people to read and/or edit the article... Boud (talk) 10:23, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
Independently, any objections to removing ", before 1904" from the figure caption? It's sourced, but it sounds a bit odd. There's no default expectation to show photos of deceased people as they were in their oldest age prior to dying, even if that seems to be common (e.g. Einstein). Boud (talk) 10:23, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
ALT3 is fine with me, I just didn't want to single out Reger as he was "my topic" in 2016. I say it's fine also to receive no more guideline abbreviations ;) - I thought that any date in the caption would be better than no date, but let the style of dress and hair say so. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:19, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol confirmed.svg Guideline abbreviations avoid having to re-explain what other people have already explained quite nicely and more carefully :). Anyway, good to go with consensus on ALT3. Boud (talk) 13:55, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg Returned to prep for further consideration of hook, with particular reference to the term "lieder". Cwmhiraeth (talk) 08:35, 25 September 2018 (UTC)
I am not sure I understand what you mean by "term lieder". Every now and then, we use "art songs", but "lieder" is more specific for the German ones, as mélodies is for the French. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:14, 25 September 2018 (UTC)
Symbol voting keep.svg I have changed the wording in the article and as long as you are happy with that change, ALT3 can be used. I will leave someone else to promote the hook, and they can choose whether to use the image or not. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 09:54, 25 September 2018 (UTC)
I am happy with the change, thank for a constructive solution. If I had more time, I'd do the same for Strauss, and Matthiesen ... - She must have been quite extraordinary to have inspired so many creative minds. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:30, 25 September 2018 (UTC)
Did you read the nomination, "She must have been quite extraordinary to have inspired so many creative minds."? Did you see that this was a compromise? A cheap hook for all could be that she was the teacher and mother-in-law of the Nazi dream tenor, another, quirky, that she trained Elisabeth Schwarzkopf wrong, -- but I am here to say something about her singing. Please let me. - On our national holiday, and regular concert day, with company and with a cold, thinking of the amiable dwellings ... --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:04, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
What about a hook based on the approved hook, but focusing only on one or the other? Say, instead of mentioning both Alto Rhapsody and the Lieder, why not a hook only focusing on Alto Rhapsody or only focusing on Reger's Lieder for her? But honestly I still have doubts if the first suggestion could work as the importance of Alto Rhapsody isn't immediately clear to non-classical music fans. Or perhaps, as you mentioned, maybe a hook about Mysz-Gmeiner's links to her students might work as well. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:28, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
We need Lieder, and better many composers than only one, which was a compromise. The well-known Alto Rhapsody with the well-known Philharmonic was meant to add something people are more familiar with, but should not be the only thing said about her who was known for Lieder internationally. - Off to singing, which me luck with my slightly damaged alto voice. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:21, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
Still with a head full of Brahms, new day. Please help me. I have little problem finding one cute thing about a short composition, but when it comes to the rich life of a creative person, I feel that one cute things is enough. No link to a student, please, it's distracting. I didn't even want a link to a specific composer. She inspired several of her contemporaries to write lieder for her, and to accompany her in performance, and I know no other person about whom that could be said. Can you word it? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:20, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
ps: if possible, still mentioning Transsylvania and teaching. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:21, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
It's been that long because it was pulled from prep but not returned to the noms page, until I noticed and did it. Last thing was asking YOU for help. I can't look right now. How can we say that she was a great lieder singer who worked with composers such as Max Reger and Richard Strauss - the big names at the time! - who wrote for her and accompanied her, - in 200 chars? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:58, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
Narutolovehinata5, no help yet, so I try again:
ALT4: ... that Lula Mysz-Gmeiner (pictured), a contralto and influential voice teacher from Transylvania, performed lieder accompanied by composers such as Max Reger and Richard Strauss?
- letting people guess that her contemporaries also wrote for her. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:43, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on August 17

Georg Cantor's first set theory article

Georg Cantor, c. 1870.
Georg Cantor, c. 1870.
  • ... that some mathematicians have disagreed about whether Georg Cantor's proof of the existence of transcendental numbers is constructive or merely existential?

Proof is constructive: Dasgupta 2014, p. 107; Sheppard 2014, pp. 131–132. Proof is non-constructive: Jarvis 2014, p. 18; Chowdhary 2015, p. 19; Stewart 2015, p. 285; Stewart & Tall 2015, p. 333.

Created/expanded by RJGray (talk) and Michael Hardy (talk). Nominated by Michael Hardy (talk) at 04:21, 19 August 2018 (UTC).

  • Not a review, but you should link and boldface the article in the hook. Catrìona (talk) 05:03, 19 August 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg Recently promoted GA article, so clearly meets the article criteria. Original hook is rather technical; I provided a substitute. The QPQ check didn't turn up a review by the nominator - please provide a link to a review. RockMagnetist(talk) 15:31, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
@RockMagnetist: I did this review. Michael Hardy (talk) 22:10, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol confirmed.svg On further investigation, it appears that the nominator, despite over 200,000 edits, has never nominated a DYK article before. Welcome to DYK, Michael Hardy! RockMagnetist(talk) 19:27, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg I formatted the hook to add "(pictured)". However, there is number confusion between "a transcendental number" and "they" — should the end of the hook be "or merely proves it exists"? Yoninah (talk) 21:36, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
I'm not the submitter of this DYK, but in my opinion the meaning would be conveyed by changing the last two words of the hook. You could change "..they exist" to "..such numbers exist". EdJohnston (talk) 21:48, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
@EdJohnston: thanks, I like that. Waiting for the nominator to weigh in... Yoninah (talk) 21:53, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
@Yoninah: @EdJohnston: The singular in "how to construct a transcendental number" is appropriate since in this context one would construct them one at a time, and the plural is appropriate in "they exist" since the proof shows that many transcendental numbers exist, not just one. Whether it says "they exist" or "such numbers exist" doesn't seem immensely important to me, since the meaning of "they" seems clear from the context. I suppose erring on the side of caution one should be explicit and say "such numbers exist." Michael Hardy (talk) 23:14, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
  • Thank you. Restoring tick per RockMagnetist's review. Wait a minute — the review didn't confirm that the five main DYK criteria have been met. Here is a full review: GA approved. New enough, long enough, well referenced, neutrally written, no close paraphrasing seen in online sources. Hook ref verified and cited inline. Images in article and hook are freely licensed. No QPQ needed for nominator with less than 5 DYK credits.
  • Tweaked hook wording:
  • ALT1a: ... that mathematicians do not agree on whether a proof in Georg Cantor's (pictured) first set theory article actually shows how to construct a transcendental number, or merely proves that such numbers exist?
  • Symbol confirmed.svg ALT1a good to go. Yoninah (talk) 00:05, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
  • Pulling from prep, with due apologies. @RJGray, Michael Hardy, Yoninah, and Cwmhiraeth: The hook might be okay, but the article is not sufficiently referenced. Indeed, I'm a little confused about how it passed the GA review, because though it's well written and I have no reasons to doubt its accuracy, the second half of "The development of Cantor's ideas" is completely unreferenced. Moreover, this raises neutrality issues, because the article seems to take the view that the proof is a constructive proof ("Some mathematicians have attempted to correct this misunderstanding of Cantor's work.") but this statement depends on the previous section, which, as I said, is not adequately referenced. Vanamonde (talk) 02:36, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg This was stuck in limbo as it was not re-listed. Needs a new reviewer to address concern(s) raised. Alex Shih (talk) 17:25, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
    @Alex Shih: Apologies for not relisting it, but really this doesn't need a reviewer, it needs work from the creator/nominator. If the sourcing issues were fixed I'd put this back into prep myself. Vanamonde (talk) 18:45, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
@Alex Shih: By the "creator" do you mean those who created the page, as opposed to the DYK hook? By "nominator", do you mean the person who nominated it for DYK? (That's me.) By "creator/nominator", do you mean the creator _or_ the nominator? Or do you mean it needs both? An earlier posting to my talk page left me with an impression that the issues had already been addressed. Michael Hardy (talk) 20:55, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
@Michael Hardy: I think you meant to ping me, rather than Alex. I meant that someone needs to address the sourcing issues I have raised immediately above Alex Shih's comment. The article creator and you are the people best placed to do this, and the people who have an interest in fixing the issue so that the DYK nomination may move forward. This is entirely separate from the message Yoninah left you nine days ago; these are issues I raised two days previously. Vanamonde (talk) 21:17, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93: ok, I think that point is becoming clear. Just to be clear about something else: I am the original article creator, although by now RJGray is to a large extent also the creator. He knows more about the sources and history than I do. Michael Hardy (talk) 22:09, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93: Concerning the sourcing issue about which you state: "Indeed, I'm a little confused about how it passed the GA review, because though it's well written and I have no reasons to doubt its accuracy, the second half of "The development of Cantor's ideas" is completely unreferenced." In the GA Review, the issue of references for derivations and examples did come up with respect to the section "The Proofs". This issue is the same as the one you are raising for the second half of "The development of Cantor's ideas" (in this half of the section, I am comparing the derivations in two different proofs). Here is how I handled the issue during the GA Review (next 2 paragraphs I wrote for the GA Review):
Concerning "The proofs": My approach was to stay within the guidelines of WP:Scientific citation guidelines#Examples, derivations and restatements whose first paragraph states:
"Wikipedia is neither a textbook nor a journal. Nonetheless, in mathematics and the mathematical sciences, it is frequently helpful to quote theorems, include simple derivations, and provide illustrative examples. For reasons of notation, clarity, consistency, or simplicity it is often necessary to state things in a slightly different way than they are stated in the references, to provide a different derivation, or to provide an example. This is standard practice in journals, and does not make any claim of novelty.[1] In Wikipedia articles this does not constitute original research and is perfectly permissible – in fact, encouraged – provided that a reader who reads and understands the references can easily see how the material in the Wikipedia article can be inferred. Furthermore, copying extensively from a source with only minor modifications is not normally permitted by copyright law, unless the source has a free license."
After receiving my response, the GA reviewer dropped this issue from his list of issues. --RJGray (talk) 00:43, 15 September 2018 (UTC)
I don't know about that, RJGray. It's fine to simplify a proof, but even so you should cite the original. At this point, a reader who wishes to know where that proof came from has no way to find it, which is the basic purpose of WP:V. I'm not saying you should cite every sentence, but you should cite the proof. You can add explanatory footnotes with the source if required. Vanamonde (talk) 00:58, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

What is the current status of this thing? Is it in a queue to appear under "Did you know . . . ?" on the main page? Michael Hardy (talk) 22:31, 16 September 2018 (UTC)

@Michael Hardy: No, it is not. As I said above, the article needs to have references for all the proofs, to comply with our policy on verifiability. Once the required references have been added, I will place this in a queue. Vanamonde (talk) 01:26, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93:I have supplied the references for the proofs. Because Cantor was writing a research article for researchers, he left out simple proofs. To handle this, I did the same as I had done earlier on the proof of his uncountability theorem. I point out that he did not supply a proof and then provided a proof for Wikipedia readers. Of course, I do supply a reference to where he states the result that he does not bother proving. --RJGray (talk) 16:44, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
@RJGray: Okay, I've looked at your changes. They are an improvement, but they do not entirely address my concern. My point is fairly simple; Wikipedia is not a scholarly publication. We collate information; we do not provide new information. As such, if we are presenting a proof, it must be based on a proof published in a reliable source elsewhere. We cannot publish our own proofs, even if the editor writing said proof is quite capable of doing so without error. It is possible that Wikiproject Mathematics sees this differently, in which case I'd like to see a link to that, but I cannot see how WP:V can be satisfied any other way. Please don't take this personally; this sort of mixup often occurs when content written and reviewed by editors familiar with a specific topic is brought to wider scrutiny. If you disagree with this, please feel free to request further feedback at WT:DYK. Also, since Michael Hardy has been blocked indefinitely, I'm afraid this falls entirely on your shoulders at the moment. Regards, Vanamonde (talk) 19:32, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93: Thank you for your feedback. Don't worry about me taking it personally. I like to get things right and I don't mind differences of opinion—I've handled them before. In fact, one of the pleasurable things about Wikipedia is that differences of opinion are handled with respect. Unfortunately, there are too many websites where this isn't true.
I hope you are not in a rush to settle this issue. Thanks for mentioning the Wikiproject Mathematics site. I plan to bring up the issue there after researching it a bit. Unfortunately, I didn't have much time last week to devote to studying the relevant Wikipedia policies.
This issue is important for me to because I suspect it will occur in the future. I tend to work in history of mathematics and may be faced again with the fact that research mathematicians tend to leave out simple derivations or proofs when communicating with their fellow research mathematicians via articles and letters. The only reason that I provided my own simple derivations was because Cantor left out two: one in his article and the other in a letter to Dedekind. I could follow Cantor and skip the derivations. However, because Wikipedia appeals to a wide audience, I wanted to make sure readers had a complete proof rather than expecting them to finish it. --RJGray (talk) 17:18, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
@RJGray: I am not in a hurry, though we should try to keep it to a reasonable schedule to be fair to the DYK process. Thanks for not taking it personally. Your position about wanting readers to have a complete proof is quite reasonable, and I'm certainly not suggesting that your derivation is wrong, only that it wouldn't be acceptable on its own even if it were entirely correct, without backing from a reliable source. Regards, Vanamonde (talk) 17:23, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93: If I compute 5283 × 6117 and get 32,316,111, it may be that no "reliable source" can be cited for the value of the product of those two numbers. But the technique is taught in elementary school. Something similar applies in many cases to routine algebraic derivations in Wikipedia articles. The is then the question of where to draw the line between that sort of thing and original research. Michael Hardy (talk) 19:19, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
@Michael Hardy: I would not ask for a source for routine arithmetic, per WP:CALC. However, I would draw the line for requiring reliable sources somewhere between a single-step computation that anyone with access to the internet is capable of performing on their device, and Georg Cantor's theorems. I firmly believe those require a source, and that presenting an editor's own derivation isn't enough. If you disagree, I suggest you invite comments from other editors at WT:DYK. Vanamonde (talk) 19:38, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93: Thank you for your patience. Even though I haven't changed my opinion that sources are not needed in this case, I decided that finding sources would be a good challenge of my knowledge of the literature. It took a bit of work but I suceeded. I have updated the Wikipedia article.
The source I found for my proof of the existence of transcendental numbers is Perron's book, which is in German and has not been translated. However, in my research on Wikipedia policies, I learned how to handle this: I've put the German proof and my translation of it in a note (see WP:V#Quoting). The source I found for my proof of Cantor's uncountability theorem is the article "Georg Cantor and Transcendental Numbers".
I must say that I am happier having the sources than not having them—I like to saturate Wikipedia articles with citations. I regard citations as doorways to deeper knowledge of a subject.
However, I think that Wikipedia's verifiability policy of citations and reliable sources can be characterized as "passive verifiability". By this I mean that the citations mostly sit there passively with few people actively looking many of them up. Consider my article with its 63 references with one reference containing 6 citations. How many citations will the typical reader of an article look up? Probably far fewer than 63. On the positive side, the citations are available if issues come up.
Now consider an article's mathematical proofs. Proofs actively engage readers who think through them and decide if they are correct or not. And if they aren't correct, they can fix them. So proofs are an example of "active verifiability". I always read mathematical proofs carefully and when I find one that is inaccurate or not clear, I rewrite it. So the accuracy of a mathematical proof depends not just on the person who initially writes it. Its verifiability is increased by everyone who reads it, thinks about it, and improves it.
On the other hand, I seldom look up the citations of a Wikipedia article unless I'm interested in reading further on the subject. I know it's hard work checking sources—the last thing I do before posting an article I wrote is to check all my citations for accuracy.
Another weakness of Wikipedia's verifiability policy is that reliable sources may have errors. The section "The disagreement about Cantor's existence proof" gives examples. In fact, the books asserting that Cantor's existence proof is non-constructive outnumber the books asserting asserting his proof is constructive.
I wish to thank you for suggesting your improvement. This article has now benefited from two GA reviews (it failed the first one but that motivated me to do a second rewrite of the article) and one DYK review. —RJGray (talk) 22:59, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
@RJGray: Thanks for the sources. Unless I'm missing something, though, the "first theorem" still doesn't have citations. Also: I'm understanding, from what you said above, that you're using the same source for all of the second theorem (footnote A). If this is the case, please duplicate it (you can just copy the footnote) at the end of all of the relevant paragraphs; else this is going to run into trouble again when it's in prep. In general, even if you're using the same source for multiple paragraphs, duplicate it at the end of each paragraph. As to your other points, I agree in theory, but the fact is that even though I have more mathematical education than probably 99% of the world's population, I would miss most errors in a proof such as this one; which is why we need the refs, even if they aren't followed up on. Vanamonde (talk) 01:14, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
(GA reviewer here and I've been lurking for a few days.) Per WP:CITEDENSE, there's no "one citation per paragraph" rule on Wikipedia. Repeating a citation every paragraph is an optional stylistic choice. If a user would remove this from the DYK queue for that reason then they would be in the wrong. As for the "first theorem" section, if my memory is correct then I recall that it's a summary of parts of the Cantor article, vacuously sourced to that article, along with a bit of WP:SCG/WP:CALC. (Per WP:MINREF it didn't need an inline citation... but the fact you claim it does counts as a "challenge" and actually means it now does, somewhat bizarrely.) Bilorv(c)(talk) 01:42, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
@Bilorv: Well, in my opinion articles should always have a minimum of one citation per paragraph, but in any case this is actually codified as a DYK rule (supplementary rule D2, if you're interested). In any case, if parts are based on the George Cantor article, then that needs to be fixed. Wikipedia isn't a reliable source, and if that article is in such good shape, then it should be easy enough to copy references over. Vanamonde (talk) 01:55, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
To clarify, when I said "vacuously sourced to that article", I meant "vacuously sourced to the primary source of Cantor's paper", not some other Wikipedia article. Bilorv(c)(talk) 10:45, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
That's even easier, then: just add that as a source, with an explanatory footnote if necessary, at the end of every paragraphs that's taken from it. Vanamonde (talk) 17:44, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93 and Bilorv: I don't want to bother with the question of whether or not I need references in the subsections "First theorem" and "Second theorem". I was surprised that I didn't put them in! I like to encourage my readers to read Cantor's original article. One way I do this is to supply references to his article and to a translation of his article whether they are needed or not. So I added them.
Concerning the DYK supplementary rule D2. This rule states: "The article in general should use inline, cited sources. A rule of thumb is one inline citation per paragraph, excluding the lead, plot summaries, and paragraphs which summarize other cited content." According to Rule of thumb: "The English phrase rule of thumb refers to a principle with broad application that is not intended to be strictly accurate or reliable for every situation." If it was a rigid rule that required one citation per paragraph, I've already came up with two problems such a rigid requirement can create:
(1) Let's say I had an article that I planned to nominate for DYK and one paragraph of my article had no citation but the following paragraph had more than one. Then I might change my paragraphing so the first paragraph would have one citation. Of course, this could negatively affect the writing quality.
(2) Consider the Cantor article. The first paragraph of Georg Cantor's first set theory article#Example of Cantor's construction is a description of a simple example that I made up to illustrate how Cantor's construction works. I am permitted to have such an example by WP:Scientific citation guidelines#Examples, derivations and restatements: "Nonetheless, in mathematics and the mathematical sciences, it is frequently helpful to quote theorems, include simple derivations, and provide illustrative examples. For reasons of notation, clarity, consistency, or simplicity it is often necessary to state things in a slightly different way than they are stated in the references, to provide a different derivation, or to provide an example. … In Wikipedia articles this does not constitute original research and is perfectly permissible …" Since I'm providing the example it has no reference. So if rule D2 was rigid, I'd have to decide which was most important: A "Did you know" or an example that helped my readers.
By the way, I have 67 references in 49 paragraphs, which is 1.37 refs/paragraph. So my article is averaging 37% more refs per paragraph than an article that only contains one ref per paragraph. ≈—RJGray (talk) 01:42, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
@RJGray: I'm a bit busy at the moment so please forgive the short response. First off, right now I'm only seeing a citation for theorem two. Second, the problems with writing style and structure are easily addressed by duplicating references. I feel like I am somehow not getting this point across, but it's very simple, and it addresses your concern entirely. If multiple paragraphs are sourced to page 2 of Cantor's paper, then you just cite page 2 of Cantor's paper after each of those paragraphs. Why is this proving so difficult? Vanamonde (talk) 01:51, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93: Sorry, I'm a bit tired and it appears that I didn't submit my changes, which are done now. On paragraphing, there may be a problem on "Second theorem". I see three options on the structure of the paragraph starting: "Either the number of intervals generated is finite or infinite" Option 1: the ending of case 3 is the end of the paragraph (this is where I put a ref). Option 2: each case is a paragraph, so in this option, I would put a ref after every case. Option 3: the sentence following the cases is the end of the paragraph, so in this option, I would put the ref at the end of this sentence. I chose Option 1 because I think the colon implies that the three cases belong to the same sentence as the colon. Which option do you think is best? Take your time answering, I'm getting off the computer now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by RJGray (talkcontribs) 02:37, 28 September 2018 (UTC)
@RJGray: My apologies, I've been inactive for the past few days. Your latest changes look good. My final citation quibble is about the proof provided in "dense sequences", which also appears not to have a source. Since the article does not seem to hinge on this, you could simply temporarily remove the section if you want to move forward with this quickly. Vanamonde (talk) 17:01, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93: I'm happy that you are pleased with my latest changes. I've made one further change. In my last response, I mentioned the "Example of Cantor's construction" as not needing a citation for an example. I suspect that quite a few examples in math articles won't have a citation available, but it turns out that this particular example does have one. When I was writing it, I must have been concentrating on the math and forgot that nearly the same example appeared in the literature as an exercise. But returning to it now, I remembered that it looked familiar and remembered the probable source. I've added a note about this.
Concerning dense sequences, I have a suggestion. But first the reasons I would like to keep it:
1. In the next section, I use denseness to prove that Cantor's construction generates infinitely many intervals.
2. It identifies what is mathematically special about the second case.
3. It deepens a reader's appreciation of the three cases because they are regarding them from a different angle.
4. It helped me in my reply to Ipsic's question (see next section of Talk).
5. See last sentence in next paragraph.
My suggestion is to bring in Cantor's second proof of the uncountability of the reals, which he published in 1879. This proof is not generally known, at least not in the US. As far as I know, it hasn't been translated into English, but there is a French translation from the 1880s. His second proof only uses 2 cases: The given set of reals is dense or not dense in the interval [ab]. In the second case, there's an open interval (cd) containing no reals from the given set, so any real in this open interval does not belong to the given set (this handles cases 1 and 3 in one step). In ths dense case, he gets a single real number. I think that this addition would add to the comprehensiveness of the article and it's a simple example of a great mathematician viewing his theorem from another angle and developing a new proof.
Of course, it will take me a bit of time to add the new material in a succinct way that meshes nicely with what's there. I hope to keep it down to a short paragraph. The big unknown is his dense case. I didn't have the time today to look at it (I'd like to figure it out on my own before looking at his proof). Also, I will be on vacation from next Wednesday to the following Tuesday and won't be around computers as much, but I will have hours of travel to work on the new material.
Thanks for all your feedback. I do appreciate the work you are doing for this Cantor article and the work you do for Wikipedia. —RJGray (talk) 01:43, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
@RJGray: If you have a citation available, that's great, and you should add it. About denseness: I recognize that there's good reasons for wanting it in the article, but unless Cantor's 1879 paper is implying it very directly, I don't think that's a good route to go down. We're coming back to a fairly basic problem here. I probably have had more education in math than most Wikipedia readers: yet, I could not tell if there was an error in the mathematical argument you put forth above. Thus in the absence of a reference saying that, it isn't really verifiable. Please understand, I'm not blaming you for this; it's quite possibly common practice in the mathematics Wikiproject. But to an outsider, this is a problem. Vanamonde (talk) 01:52, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
I'm afraid this doesn't accord with the text of WP:SCG. It reads "Some statements are uncontroversial and widely known among people familiar with a discipline." It then gives three statements which I do not understand at all, and yet they don't need citations because they are uncontroversial among people familiar with the subject. In the case of dense sequences, I can understand the argument easily using only first year undergraduate knowledge (because that's my current level of education), so it's hardly controversial or requiring of esoteric methods. Bilorv(c)(talk) 11:16, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
@Bilorv: I'm aware of the guideline, but I'm afraid you're misreading it. The guideline allows some flexibility in where citations need to be placed, and how general they might be. It does not permit completely unsourced content. Some source in the article needs to support the information in it. Vanamonde (talk) 14:50, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93: My current plan to eliminate the "Dense sequences" subsection and add a new section "Cantor's second uncountability proof" following the "Example of Cantor's construction" subsection. I figured out Cantor's 1879 proof and now I've starting reading it. He calls it a simplification of his 1874 proof and it is. It only has 2 cases, the old Case 1 and Case 3 are handled at the same time, and Case 2 is the dense sequence case. This happens because he points out that there are two kinds of sets: those that are dense in the interval [ab] and those that are not. This splits the new proof into two cases at the start. His original proof starts with his construction and the construction divides the proof into three cases. Since I'll be gone for a week, it will take me a minimum of a week and a half, but probably a bit longer since I want the writing to be as good as the rest of the article and this always takes time. So you will have your references and I'll have that Case 2 is the dense set (or sequence) case. Also, readers will learn of Cantor's second proof, which I didn't know about for years. Overall, I think it will improve the article. —RJGray (talk) 19:32, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
@RJGray: Sounds good, ping me when you are done. Vanamonde (talk) 20:14, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5 and Vanamonde93: My original time estimate was way off. I have finished the translation of Cantor's second uncountability proof of 1879 and have had it corrected by another editor. I am providing interested readers a with wikitable that consists of the English translation of the proof and the German text so they can be read and compared in parallel. However, there seems to be a problem with having a collapsed table in a Notes section, so it appears that I might have to choose between an uncollapsed (large) table or have an ending subsection titled: "Appendix: Cantor's second uncountability theorem with translation". I need to know the Wikipedia guidelines on this. I am now writing a new section "Cantor's second uncountability proof" that will have to be cleanly integrated with a couple of the existing sections. Good news for Vanamonde93: I can use Cantor's 1879 proof as a reference for the proof I gave in Case 2 of the subsection "Second Theorem". My proof appears as part of his 1897 proof, which is no surprise since it's the obvious proof. —RJGray (talk) 23:59, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
@RJGray: The niceties of MOS are not my speciality, but as long as it complies with MOS:TABLE, I think both options could work. I personally have not seen an "appendix" before, so I have a slight preference for the other structure. Vanamonde (talk) 14:06, 29 October 2018 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5 and Vanamonde93: I apologize for not keeping you up-to-date. I'm nearly done--mostly polishing and a few other relatively small things to do. I should be done by Sunday or Monday. —RJGray (talk) 18:47, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5 and Vanamonde93: Thank you for your patience. The big changes are the addition of the new section "Cantor's second uncountability proof" and the removal of subsection "Dense sequences". If I had been familiar with Cantor's 1879 article earlier, I would have made it a part of the Wikipedia article earlier because it's a case of Cantor improving his old proof using the topological notion of everywhere dense in an interval. So it sheds light on the key proof of his 1874 article. I wish to thank Vanamonde93 for his DYK work on this article. It was his comments that led me to the changes I have made. Also, wish to thank Jochen Burghardt for his help in getting a collapsed wikitable in a ref note and for his correcting my errors in my translation of Cantor's 1879 proof.

Articles created/expanded on August 31

Shannon Evans

Shannon Evans
Shannon Evans
  • ... that basketball player Shannon Evans' mother, grandparents, and great-aunt helped him pay for prep school? Source: From prep school to the Pac-12: The long journey of ASU guard Shannon Evans

Created by Editorofthewiki (talk). Nominated by Runningibis (talk) at 16:13, 31 August 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg Article created on 30 August, submitted one day later. Long enough. Neutral & no copyright issues. Fact from hook is included in source but is not immediately followed by an in-line citation. Otherwise sourced appropriately. QPQ completed. Suggest hook has boarderline appeal to a broad audience (who might not understand the significance of playing for a prep school). Fact isn't currently in article but the fact that mother liquidated (cashed out) her 401k might help spice this up and/or make clear why attending prep school was important (to qualify for NCAA scholarships). Best, Barkeep49 (talk) 15:30, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
Suggestion, you could also make note of the prep school being a Christian and Military institution. Flibirigit (talk) 01:40, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
Suggest as ALT2 ... that Shannon Evans left Buffalo to follow basketball coach Bobby Hurley to Arizona State
This puts the spotlight back on Evans whom the highlighted article is really about. Best, Barkeep49 (talk) 01:09, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
Neither of the new hooks are that good to be honest as they're dependent on people being familiar with Hurley, which probably even most basketball fans wouldn't know. The original proposal (about the prep school thing) is probably still the best option, though of course the issues regarding it need to be fixed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 10:21, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
I don't see what the issue is, the fact is cited in the article. ~EDDY (talk/contribs)~ 22:40, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
The problem is hook interest. Non-basketball fans wouldn't really find it interesting that a basketball player followed a coach to another school, especially if neither person is well-known. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 23:12, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
I agree with Narutolovehinata5. The proposed hooks are just very pedestrian. Drmies (talk) 01:27, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Struck ALTs 1 and 2 per above. So it's either we stick to ALT0 or a new hook is needed here. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:50, 3 November 2018 (UTC)
    I have no problems with Alt0. It is sourced in the article. Not every hook needs to be a Wow! moment. ~EDDY (talk/contribs)~ 14:21, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
Whether Alt 0 is catchy or not, if used it would need an in-line citation which it currently lacks. Best, Barkeep49 (talk) 18:02, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
It has an inline citation, not sure what you are talking about. ~EDDY (talk/contribs)~ 01:18, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
According to Wikipedia:Did you know/Reviewing guide, " The hook fact(s) must be stated in the article, and must be immediately followed by an inline citation to a reliable source." As it stands now the inline citation comes after the next sentence. I don't know if this is a true requirement but this is what I was basing my comment on. Best, Barkeep49 (talk) 17:29, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 6

Mufti Nemat

  • ... that Afghan militant Mufti Nemat has claimed that he wants others to accept his ideology "with their hearts, not by force" despite having previously waged a violent insurgency and possibly committed numerous war crimes? Source: "At their peak, the ISIS fighters in northern Afghanistan numbered as many as 500 followers of Qari Hekmatullah, until he was killed in an American airstrike in April. Mr. Rahman and Mr. Nemat, who are brothers-in-law, then emerged as the leaders of the group. [...] 'We want other people to accept our ideas with their hearts, not by force,' Mr. Nemat said. 'There is no need to force people to accept us.' [...] Many of the Islamic State's crimes are well documented in their own Facebook and WhatsApp posts, with videos of them burning opponents alive, stoning people to death, training children as fighters, and shooting bound prisoners." (Source: Are ISIS Fighters Prisoners or Honored Guests of the Afghan Government?)

Created by Applodion (talk). Self-nominated at 08:25, 13 September 2018 (UTC).

  • Oh, sorry! I did not notice that I had already used that QPQ. I will add a new one tomorrow. Applodion (talk) 20:47, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
  • I have added a new QPQ. Applodion (talk) 20:07, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

─────────────────────────Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Thank you. Ready for full review. Yoninah (talk) 20:14, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

  • I'm not sure this hook is acceptable under the content rules, since it focuses primarily on negative aspects of a living person. To be clear, I'm not defending Nemat or his actions, or suggesting that the cited source is not accurate, only noting that the hook as written doesn't appear to confirm to the DYK rules. ♠PMC(talk) 15:52, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
  • We could leave out the part about the war crimes, as he denies them. The rest of the hook, namely that he waged an insurgency despite claming be be peaceful, is undisputable, however, and is not necessarily negative. Applodion (talk) 17:21, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Full review still needed. I've struck the original hook per PMC and am listing an ALT1 that simply removes the final clause of the original, so the sourcing should be the same.BlueMoonset (talk) 16:34, 13 October 2018 (UTC)
  • ALT1: ... that Afghan militant Mufti Nemat has claimed that he wants others to accept his ideology "with their hearts, not by force" despite having previously waged a violent insurgency? (same source as above)
Symbol redirect vote 4.svg *This would land the guy a visit from the police in the UK. Szzuk (talk) 21:28, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
I have the feeling that this hook is simply not going to work. Perhaps it would be best if I would just withdraw this nomination. Applodion (talk) 22:22, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
I don't have any great opinion about the article overall, there is probably another hook you can use. Szzuk (talk) 22:27, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
Ok. How about this one:
ALT2: ... that Mufti Nemat was the head of a religious school for male and female students before joining the Afghan branch of ISIL? Source: "Mufti Nemat stayed in Sheberghan for almost two years hoping to join the ALP or pro-government militia forces in the province. As a follower of Salafism, he intended to expand the Salafi ideology in the province at the same time. In November 2016, he established a Salafi madrasa called E’ya-ye Sunnat (Rehabilitation of the Sunnah) in the city and where male and female students attended classes." (Non-Pashtun Taleban of the North (4): A case study from Jawzjan)
Applodion (talk) 10:10, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
ALT3 "...that Mufti Nemat has been accused of raping women as a commander of Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant – Khorasan Province?" "His surrender came days after a number of women in Darzab district of the province accused him and his fighters of abducting and raping them." -VOA

— Preceding unsigned comment added by RightCowLeftCoast (talkcontribs) 20:35, 3 November 2018 (UTC)

Will review please hold.-RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 20:35, 3 November 2018 (UTC)
ALT4 "... that Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant – Khorasan Province commander Mufti Nemat surrendered to the Afghan government, after a Taliban offensive against ISIL-K in 2018?""Assadullah said that Mawlawi Habib Rahman, Mufti Nematullah, Mullah Suhbatullah and Hussain Qahraman, head of the military unit of the group, along with 200 fighters, were rescued in this way. After surrendering to the government and safely arriving in Sheberghan city, Habib Rahman told media outlets that he was tired of war and had therefore joined the Afghan government’s peace process." -AAN — Preceding unsigned comment added by RightCowLeftCoast (talkcontribs) 22:08, 3 November 2018 (UTC)

Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - ALT0 eliminated, ALT1 is uncited, ALT2 ALT3 & ALT4 are cited
  • Interesting: Red XN - ALT3 is the most interesting IMHO
  • Other problems: Red XN - ALT2 & ALT4 do not focus on negative aspects of the subject of the article
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol possible vote.svg Article was nominated for QPQ on 6 September, and was created on 6 September. At the time of its creation and nomination, the article was over 5k characters of prose (without spaces). Each paragraph is sourced in line; while several sentences don't have inline citation, that is not required for a DYKN. While some usage of words on the WP:WTW list are present, it appears to be more or less neutral, if not written in a way that is slightly positive of the subject of the artlce. Article only has a 10.7% rating for Earwig's. Some problems with the hooks, see above. Article needs work for it to pass DYKN. RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 22:08, 3 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Please note that ALT3 and ALT4 were proposed by the reviewer, and will therefore need someone else to sign off on them if they are to be used. BlueMoonset (talk) 23:05, 3 November 2018 (UTC)
  • It should be noted that due to the fact that Nemat is still alive, we cannot use hooks that are overly negative: As result, ALT3 will not be acceptable. In regard to the article title, he is almost universally known as "Mufti Nemat" - per Wikipedia:Article titles that is thus the best choice for the article title. Furthermore, the article subject is probably such a vile individual that any attempt to write neutrally about him does make his article appear more positive than he probably deserves. Applodion (talk) 09:53, 4 November 2018 (UTC)
I struck out ALT3 per above. Aside from the BLP rule, I don't think it's a good idea to mention rape in the DYK box. Its supposed to be a fun gateway to learning, not a place to shock people. --Krelnik (talk) 03:11, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
See WP:NCBIO & the related WP:NCCL, regarding the alleged Mufti predominance for the alleged common name reasoning. I see that a search for Nemat is most likely to get Orzala Ashraf Nemat, so a disambig between the two individual's articles is needed; that said this NYT article refers to the subject as Mr. Nemat, and this National Post article refers to the subject of the article as just plain Nemat, and this AFghanistan Times article refers to the subject as Nematullah.
Article other issues have not been addressed. No rush per WP:NOTIMELIMIT.--RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 01:40, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
@RightCowLeftCoast: The source for ALT1 is the same as ALT0; I am unsure about rewriting the lead. Birth dates are unknown, his nationality as well as position/rank are stated, and I noted that he has been accused of war crimes. In regard to the title, would you prefer "Mufti Nemat" instead of "Mufti Nemat"? Applodion (talk) 10:45, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
Mufti, a title, shouldn't be included in the article title, I understand the reasoning for including it in the article title, but disagree with the conclusion reached. It should not just be Nemat as the subject of the article is not the primary search result for that particular pronoun. Perhaps Nematullah would be a better article name. As for the birth date, there isn't even an estimated year?--RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 17:51, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
Titles can be part of article titles if the person is best known by that name (see for example various medieval people, such as the Earls of Warwick); Nemat is simply too unspecific. Nematullah is simply his name, Nemat, with the addition of another title ("Mullah"). In regard to the birth year, the answer is no. I think it is very likely that estimates exist about his age, but I could not find a single source which mentioned his age or birth year or anything similar. Applodion (talk) 22:00, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
Perhaps Nemat (Taliban Commader) would be an alternate then?--RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 01:13, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
@RightCowLeftCoast: I had thought about that as well, but Nemat was a notable commander both among the Taliban as well as ISIL; not to mention that several other commanders exist(ed) in both groups who were named "Nemat". Furthermore, reducing him to his military activity seems not fitting either, as he was a notable enough cleric that the government banned him from teaching. Applodion (talk) 11:14, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
As this is the case, I think singling out the subject's role as a cleric, thus the title of Mufti, would de-emphasis the subject's military role. There has to be a way to disambiguate the subject from other Nemats without utilizing a title in the article name.--RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 01:37, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
@RightCowLeftCoast: Though "Mufti" is a title given for his religious role, it also covers his judical role among the militants and is a title of general respect, thus not excluding any military activities. Anyway, I don't undersatand why keeping the title as it is presents such a great problem - Numerous individuals on Wikipedia have article names that include their titles for a lack of better alternatives. When Memat's full name is one day revealed, we can still change it. Applodion (talk) 09:17, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
The Earl of Warwick article listed above, is not of a single individual, but of a series of individuals that hold the position, therefore it is similar to Surgeon General of the United States Army in that regard.
I again, and remain/continue, hold the view that a title should not be included in the article name of the individual known as Nemat, as the individual is not the most popular search result for individuals named Nemat, there should be a Nemat disambiguate article, as well as an article about this subject, but under a name which does not include the individuals title. I will agree to disagree on our differing opinions, but I think this needs a third opinion from an uninvolved editor.--RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 01:24, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
@RightCowLeftCoast: Just to be clear, I meant the individual earls (such as Henry de Beaumont, 1st Earl of Warwick) as example, not the title itself. And to add another example, take Prince Gong - The name by which he is best known (and the article title) is "Prince Gong", but that was a title (see Prince Gong (peerage)); his real name was "Yixin". Applodion (talk) 13:56, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Third opinion by an uninvolved editor requested by reviewer. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 02:49, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
    • 3O Response: I agree that the honorific title shouldn't be part of the article title (WP:TITLESINTITLES), and that parenthetic disambiguation would be the accepted practice. I understand that other stuff exists but I don't feel there's a strong case for including the title here. I would also note that the purpose of disambiguation isn't to uniquely identify the subject, but the article. There's no problem if there are other (commanders) so long as they don't have articles. (We can't worry about disambiguating from pages that don't exist yet or we'd never be able to make a decision.) From reading the article, my feeling is that he is primarily notable as a militant. I ran some pageview stats (sorry, tried linking but the pipes in the URL broke the DYKsubpage template) and it seems to me there are a couple other articles with Nemat in their titles that are ranked higher (i.e.: Nemat Shafik, Marina Nemat), so I'd suggest Nemat be made a disambiguation page and this article be moved to Nemat (militant) or somesuch. If this isn't enough to decide on a course of action, please consider listing the article at Wikipedia:Requested moves. – Reidgreg (talk) 17:35, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  • In case that it is alright to change it to a very generalized title, Nemat (militant) seems to be the best solution as it excludes neither his Taliban nor ISIL career. Applodion (talk) 19:41, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
Thanks to Reidgreg (talk · contribs) for the third opinion. I will create the disambig page. Looking forward to seeing the article move.--RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 03:55, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
Here is the disambig article Nemat (name).--RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 04:21, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
May I suggest a hat note to this disambig article be included in an appropriate place in this article?--RightCowLeftCoast (Moo) 04:37, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 12

Timeline of Cluj-Napoca

1617 engraving of Cluj/Kolozsvár/Klausenburg by Joris Hoefnagel.
1617 engraving of Cluj/Kolozsvár/Klausenburg by Joris Hoefnagel.
  • ... that throughout its long timeline the city of Cluj-Napoca was part of many empires and kingdoms, including Roman Empire, Hungarian Kingdom, Habsburg Monarchy, Austria-Hungary and Kingdom of Romania ...? Source: "MacKendrick, Paul Lachlan (2000). The Dacian Stones Speak. Routledge Monographs in Classical Studies (illustrated, reprint ed.). Chapel Hill: University of North Carolina Press."; Source: "Lukács, József (2005). Povestea "oraşului-comoară": scurtă istorie a Clujului şi a monumentelor sale [The story of the "treasure-city": a short history of Cluj and its monuments] (in Romanian). Levente Várdai. Cluj-Napoca: Apostrof. ISBN 978-973-9279-74-1. "

5x expanded by Codrinb (talk). Self-nominated at 20:00, 12 September 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg Not eligible. List articles must have at least 1,500 characters of readable prose in order to qualify for DYK. Catrìona (talk) 05:44, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
Symbol possible vote.svg This appears to be only the nominator's fifth nomination, and given that the article itself is long (the problem is that the content is presented as a list while DYK's length requirement only applies to prose), this could still work as a hook. @Codrinb: I would suggest you expand the lede section to be a summary of the whole article, ensuring that it is at least 1,500 characters. Once this is done, this can become DYK eligible. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 05:00, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
Hi all. Thank you for the feedback. I put a lot of work into this article and I will be happy to make anything that is necessary to make it eligible. Thank you for giving me a chance, @Narutolovehinata5:. The main reason for not expanding the lead more is to keep it "in sync" and consistent with all the other articles in Category:Timelines of cities in Europe. If you look at Timeline of London or Timeline of Frankfurt, they have a similar lead. If you think that I should deviate from this, in order to achieve DYK, I will do it. I will also ping @M2545: and other users involved with such lists, perhaps there are other examples of DYK or longer leads. Thanks! Codrin.B (talk) 10:32, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
Hi again, I have added a new lead as requested. Please let me know if this works. Thanks. Codrin.B (talk) 12:38, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Green tickY - Offline/paywalled citation accepted in good faith
  • Interesting: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Red XN - The grammar in the hook is weird. Roman Empire needs a definite article, as do some of the others.

Image eligibility:

QPQ: None required.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Is this one of your first five DYK noms? Catrìona (talk) 06:40, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

@Catrìona: This is the nominator's fifth nomination so no QPQ is necessary yet; however, their next DYK and beyond will require a QPQ. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 07:30, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
Thanks for the feedback. What is QPQ? ;-) How about this text and new image:
Cluj coat of arms, awarded in 1377.

Codrin.B: I would accept that if the caption were significantly shorter. 8 lines is too many. Catrìona (talk) 04:19, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Hi @Catrìona:. I removed less important aspects from the lead and kept the core ideas. The lead is now around 1800 characters. I hope this is acceptable. Thanks.Codrin.B (talk) 06:25, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
Ah, you were talking about the image caption... I never intended it to be so long. I just added the image previously with the caption I used elsewhere. To goal was to check if this image is better. I trimmed down the caption as well now. Codrin.B (talk) 06:30, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
Symbol confirmed.svg I recommend the wording "throughout its long history" rather than "throughout its long timeline". Catrìona (talk) 06:34, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
The reason I used "timeline" is to differentiate from the History of Cluj-Napoca article, which I might also work on to get it to a DYK, and also to be inline with the article title: "Timeline of Cluj-Napoca". But certainly "history" sounds better. I am fine if it has to be changed for the DYK. Thanks. Codrin.B (talk) 10:04, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svgI'm a little concerned at the amount of unsourced content here. An entry about Hadrian becoming Emperor may not need a source, but an entry about a redlinked individual such as Flavius Italicus does, I'm afraid. Vanamonde (talk) 23:02, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Actually all governors of province Dacia come out of the List of Roman governors of Dacia Traiana which in turn uses this reference: Petolescu, Constantin C. (2014). Dacia: un mileniu de istorie [Dacia: a millennium of history] (in Romanian). Bucharest: Editura Academiei Române. ISBN 978-973-27-2450-7.. I expected that this could be an issue so I started to add individual references for each governor. Thanks for bringing it up. Codrin.B (talk) 22:26, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93:, @Catrìona:, @Narutolovehinata5: - I finalized adding references to all legates, procurators and other leaders from 2nd and 3rd century. From my perspective, while it could be further improved, the article is quite well sourced for all the centuries and from a wide variety of sources. Please let me know if there is anything else I can do to make this better and get it approved. Thanks. Codrin.B (talk) 22:09, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 18

Mark Judge (writer)

Created by E.M.Gregory (talk) and Sagecandor (talk). Nominated by Sagecandor (talk) at 22:51, 23 September 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg Article has been nominated by a topic-banned and blocked user. Pending discussion here. --Pudeo (talk) 07:00, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
  • That discussion ended days, possibly weeks, ago.E.M.Gregory (talk) 01:01, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol question.svg This is a well-written interesting article, meticulously sources, and I think It's good for DYK. The original hook is a bit boring to readers who don't already know the writer, also it's not clearly stated that way in the article, or did I miss something? The ALT would be better if it also said that he wrote a book about that grandfather. E.M.Gregory, are you willing to work on hooks and article? Or anybody else? - In the article, I think the court incident has too much weight in both lead and article. More lead about other things, please, or less about the incident. His articles: they are formatted with template citation, which expects them to be used as references. Please find a way to avoid the ugly error messages that they are not used. Please never use "Selected" without giving the criteria. I just removed it. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:28, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Second thought, catchy title:
ALT2: ... that Mark Judge wrote the book A Tremor of Bliss: Sex, Catholicism, and Rock 'n' Roll, published in 2010? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:49, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
ALT3: ...that Mark Judge wrote a book about how dancing helped him stop drinking? E.M.Gregory (talk) 00:51, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
Invited to look again, E.M.Gregory, thank you improvements. Still too concerns: too little in the lead about his work, and still ugly errror messages such as "Harv warning: There is no link pointing to this citation. The anchor is named CITEREFJudge1995" which I think would go away if you used "cite book" instead of "citation". I like ALT3, but of course like ALT2 better, which would ned someone else to approve. If nobody does that, I'll eventually approve ALT3. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:40, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 20

Exhibition of Australian Art in London

‘The purple noon's transparent might’
‘The purple noon's transparent might’
  • ... that Arthur Streeton's 1896 painting 'The purple noon's transparent might' (pictured) won critical acclaim at the 1898 Exhibition of Australian Art in London? Source: "Such a landscape as Mr. Arthur Streeton's 'Purple Noon's Transparent Light,' with its admirable drawing and aerial perspective, and its splendid force of colour, would hold its own in any London gallery" The Argus, quoting The Studio.

Created by HappyWaldo (talk). Self-nominated at 02:04, 20 September 2018 (UTC).

  • HappyWaldo, I corrected the painting title to remove apostrophes and be in uppercase—can you confirm that is correct? Also, is there a reason for "might" vs "light" there? Did the newspaper run a typo? (I want to confirm that there's not a second similarly named painting before we all get egg on our faces!) Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 03:59, 22 September 2018 (UTC)
The correct title is ‘The purple noon's transparent might’, with the apostrophes, as the painting takes its title from Percy Bysshe Shelley's "Stanzas Written in Dejection, Near Naples". See the National Gallery of Victoria's page for the painting. It is certainly an error on the part of the newspaper. - HappyWaldo (talk) 02:17, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
@HappyWaldo: Fascinating! Thanks for the confirmation, and I've re-re-corrected the painting title above. One more query: would you consider this alternate hook?
ALT1: ... that no other "major survey" of Australian art in London has come close to reaching the level of female representation achieved by the 1898 Exhibition of Australian Art in London? Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 02:57, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
No worries. I did consider going with a hook about the level of female representation, but since it's an art page, it seemed fitting to have an accompanying image. I went with the Streeton because many critics called it a highlight of the show. - HappyWaldo (talk) 05:12, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
@HappyWaldo: Gotcha—I totally get that motivation. Although I don't think it's necessarily the best hook in the article, I'm happy to Symbol confirmed.svg approve this! Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 03:03, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg None of the main points of WP:DYKR have been addressed in the review above: I checked and the article is new and long enough, A lone, standalone sentence was not sourced, which technically qualifies as its own paragraph. I corrected this by adding a source to verify the content (diff), so this is okay now. Is the content of the hook properly verified in the article by the source in the article? Does the article contain plagiarism or close paraphrasing? Also it appears that the nominator needs to perform a QPQ review before this can move forward, as per the results of QPQ check. North America1000 05:00, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
While it would be better to cite The Studio directly, I can't access any online British newspaper archive (from what I can tell, they all require a paid membership). The Argus was "considered to be the general Australian newspaper" of the time, so I think it's reliable and gives an accurate assessment of The Studio's review. I will review another DYK shortly. - HappyWaldo (talk) 23:19, 29 September 2018 (UTC)
  • @HappyWaldo: it has been almost 2 months since your last post. Do you plan to continue with this nomination? Yoninah (talk) 19:55, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Yoninah: Hi, I finally got around to reviewing another nom. - HappyWaldo (talk) 22:45, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

─────────────────────────Symbol redirect vote 4.svg New reviewer needed to check the article against all criteria. Please note NorthAmerica's comments above. Additionally, the ALT1 needs to be reviewed by an uninvolved editor. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 09:38, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svg - Looking at the Earwigs report for the article there is a large amount of close paraphrasing present. HappyWaldo, looking at the report, can you go through and reword the (non direct quoted areas) that are flagged? Best, Mifter (talk) 20:59, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 22

Disappearing World (TV series)

  • ... that the producer of the TV series Disappearing World acknowledged that the episodes "more often reflect a changing world than a disappearing one"? Source: quote from "Disappearing World: A Guide for Anthropologists," article in Passages: A Chronicle of the African Humanities reproduced at University of Michigan Publishing

Created by Rigadoun (talk). Self-nominated at 16:09, 24 September 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg The article is new enough, plenty long enough, and nominated timely. QPQ was done No copyvios were found (AGF since a major source is not online). The hook is sourced but IMO is not very interesting - not "grabby" or curiosity-provoking as a hook should be. What would you think about something like
  • alt1 ... that the title of the documentary television series Disappearing World has been described as "something of an albatross"? (sourced to the same work as the original hook proposal)

Rigadoun, if you prefer to stick with the original hook I will still approve this, but I thought I would make the suggestion. MelanieN (talk) 20:19, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Fine by me. (By the way, the Loizos article is available in a free PDF from AnthroSource here; I just added it to the citation.) Rigadoun (talk) 15:31, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
Symbol confirmed.svg Thanks. Good to go with alt1. MelanieN (talk) 16:56, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg @MelanieN: Per Rule H2, you cannot approve your own hook. Could another reviewer take a look at ALT1? Yoninah (talk) 17:32, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
Oops, sorry. MelanieN (talk) 02:05, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg Second review: Personally, I find the first hook cute, and appropriate for a quirky slot, which is always desirable. But if you prefer ALT1, that hook ref is offline and AGF, and cited inline. However, all the charts under Episodes are not cited. Where did you get this information from? Yoninah (talk) 20:37, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
@Rigadoun: I think the above question, about the charts not being cited, is addressed to you. Also, you and Yoninah should decide what hook to use. MelanieN (talk) 00:32, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @MelanieN: it seems the nominator hasn't edited since October 16. I am inclined to give it a few more days and then close it as unsuccessful. Yoninah (talk) 00:39, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Yoninah: Would a primary source be acceptable in this case? There's always Cite Episode for these kinds of things. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 02:05, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I'm not familiar with that. But what about footnote 3? Does anyone have access to the full article to check if these episodes are listed there? Yoninah (talk) 13:55, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Sorry, I've been too busy to reply or update the refs in the article. The list was a combination of footnote 3 (which is complete, but only to 1980) and IMDb (IIRC, that was the only list that gave the air dates), and information from the blurbs at the RAI Film Festival (to confirm what they were about). Rigadoun (talk) 20:09, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Rigadoun: please add the sources before or after the box. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 23:48, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 23

Conquest Brigade

Foundation of the Conquest Brigade in 2013
Foundation of the Conquest Brigade in 2013
  • ... that the Conquest Brigade (pictured) was described as "moderate Islamist" group, despite closely cooperating with ISIL and supporting the extermination of a religious minority in Syria? Source: "Noteworthy also from the fall of the Mannagh airbase is a video released by the battalion Liwa al-Fatah, described by one writer as a "moderate Islamist" group. A quick glance at the video quickly demonstrates that in analysis, the term "moderate Islamist" in this context is quite meaningless. First, Abu Jandal al-Masri, the leader of the JMWA contingent--identified immediately by the speaker who filmed the video as synonymous with ISIS--is seen to be embracing a member of Liwa al-Fatah. Abu Jandal then proclaims, "I swear by God we will not leave a single Alawite alive in Syria... state of Islam, state of the Caliphate." This is all proclaimed to the assent of "God is great" from the other fighters, including the Liwa al-Fatah member who filmed the video." (The Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham, pp. 24, 25)

Created by Applodion (talk). Self-nominated at 19:04, 23 September 2018 (UTC).

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol voting keep.svg You need to include (pictured) somewhere in the hook to attach a picture. Catrìona (talk) 07:08, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Added "pictured" and QPQ. Applodion (talk) 07:29, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svg This was pulled from the main page by Stephen due to sourcing issues raised at WP:ERRORS. As the article was up for less than an hour, it probably deserves a second chance, but right now a lot of work needs to be done if this is to return to DYK. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:54, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

@Narutolovehinata5: Frankly, I do not understand the problem. The source is reliable and clear about the issue, and it is inline-sourced. Further sources for the hook are given in the article, for example the Historical Dictionary of Islamic Fundamentalism clearly states that the group's members were "aligning themselves with the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) for a time". Applodion (talk) 10:11, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
As the main criticism was about the hook being too broad, how about: ALT1: ... that the Conquest Brigade (pictured) was described by one writer as "moderate Islamist" group, despite closely cooperating with ISIL and supporting the extermination of a religious minority in Syria? (same source) Applodion (talk) 10:52, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 25

Wilhelm Kempf (bishop)

Relief bust of Wilhelm Kempf
Relief bust of Wilhelm Kempf

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 08:03, 2 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol confirmed.svg Good article that reads well. I've only made a couple of minor style tweaks. Checklist: hook validated directly from www.limburg.de source, ☑Y, length ☑Y, timescale ☑Y, sufficiently referenced, albeit some taken in good faith ☑Y, structure and style ☑Y. As far as I'm concerned this is good to go. Bermicourt (talk) 20:09, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
Symbol question.svg Hello, I came to promote this, but perhaps the hook could be rewritten to make it snappier? It doesn't seem that clear right now, particularly the part that says "introduced the changes of the Second Vatican Council in which he took part". Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 10:39, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
Not sure what you mean, - could you make a suggestion? My try (and sorry that I am not gifted with snappyness):
ALT1: ... that Wilhelm Kempf (pictured), Bishop of Limburg from 1949 to 1981, took part in the Second Vatican Council, and introduced its changes in his diocese?
The council changed the church's view on/of itself dramatically, but tough to say that in few words. Or could you? Or someone watching? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:53, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
The hook seems to imply that it was Kempf who proposed the changes done in Vatican II (as in during the council itself), which is contrary to what the article says (which merely says that he introduced the Vatican II changes in Limburg). As for ALT1, I don't think it works since Vatican II was implemented throughout the Catholic world and thus being the one to introduce it in a diocese is not uncommon (disclosure: I'm Catholic so I'm actually familiar with Vatican II and the changes implemented because of it). Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:11, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
ALT2: ... that Wilhelm Kempf (pictured), Bishop of Limburg from 1949 to 1981, took part in the Second Vatican Council?
No room to say that he enthusiastically introduced the changes, and was criticised for it, while others may have done only what they had to. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:40, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
@Bermicourt: Thoughts on ALT1 and ALT2? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 20:53, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
I like the source which says: "Bishop Wilhelm Kempf carried the ethos [from the end] of the Second Vatican Council, of which he was one of five sub-secretaries, to his Diocese, which - although small in area and numbers - soon set an outstanding example [in terms of the reforms]." I wonder if part of that could be woven into a hook? Just trying to help. Bermicourt (talk) 18:37, 23 October 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 26

Lee Brian Schrager

  • Reviewed: Don't have to do this in my first one

Created by Fabdoull (talk). Self-nominated at 16:49, 15 October 2018 (UTC).

  • User:BlueMoonset, can you see if someone can have a look at this? Someone who owes you a favor? Thanks! Dr Aaij (talk) 15:56, 29 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg @Fabdoull: This nomination meets the DYK criteria of newness and length. The article is sufficiently neutral and I detected no copyright issues or close paraphrasing. The hook is interesting and probably true, but there is no cited sentence in the article stating that SOBEWFF is one of the biggest food and wine festivals in the world. If you can find a source to back up the claim, please add the fact and cite it in the article. If you can't find a (reliable, independent) source, then perhaps you could suggest a new hook. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 13:34, 3 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Thank you for the review. I just modified the the hook and found a new source to back up the claim.
@Dr Aaij and Fabdoull: Neither of the quotes given above states that it is one of the biggest food and wine festivals in the US, and nor does the article make this claim. The hook must have backing from the article and source, so please suggest a better hook. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 09:46, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • ALT1: ...that one of Lee Brian Schrager's books "celebrates" more than 50 recipes for fried chicken? Miami New Times
    • Cwmhiraeth, what do you make of this one? Doesn't it make you hungry? Dr Aaij (talk) 17:04, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol confirmed.svg I think ALT1 should do, although there might be some resistance from other quarters. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 19:14, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg Returned from prep per discussion at WT:DYK#Prep 3: Fried chicken. Besides the hook fact not appearing in the article, ALT1 smacks of self-promotion. Please note that I added a few "citation needed" tags for info that must be cited. Yoninah (talk) 18:46, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 27

Dennis Albaugh

1957 Chevrolet Bel Air Convertible
1957 Chevrolet Bel Air Convertible
  • ... that Dennis Albaugh owns "probably" the best collection of Chevy convertibles ('57 Bel Air pictured) in the US? Source: " 'He's got a fabulous collection,' said Murl Randall, 83, a Chevrolet historian and collector from Houghton Lake, Mich., who is known as Pinky. 'It's probably the best assemblage of convertible Chevys in the country.' " ([5])
  • Alt1: ... that Dennis Albaugh has rounded-up "probably" the best collection of Chevy convertibles ('57 Bel Air pictured) in the US?

Created by Edwardx (talk) and Philafrenzy (talk). Nominated by Edwardx (talk) at 22:08, 3 October 2018 (UTC).

Added Alt - he made his money from a generic version of the pesticide Roundup. Philafrenzy (talk) 09:47, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
  • New article that's long enough, decently written, and sourced. Hooks are cited and I prefer Alt1 because of the pun. Image is public domain. Symbol question.svg Will be good to go after Edwardx adds his QPQ. Morgan Ginsberg (talk) 11:35, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg The QPQ has been done. But I don't like putting "probably" in quotes; it looks like it's implying it's not the best collection. Also, the pun is totally lost on the casual hook reader, and clicking on the link to get to a herbacide page looks like an error. Could you submit another alt? If you want to use the "probably" quote, maybe use more of the quote. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 20:44, 11 November 2018 (UTC)


fossil femurs of Vorombe
fossil femurs of Vorombe
  • ... that weighing on average around 650 kilograms (1,430 lb), the Madagascan fossil bird Vorombe (femur pictured) was the heaviest bird known? Source

Created by Extrapolaris (talk) and Achat1999 (talk). Nominated by Casliber (talk) at 09:00, 28 September 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg This interesting article is new enough and long enough. The article is neutral and I detected no policy issues. The image is appropriately licensed but I don't think it adds much to the nomination. A QPQ has been done. @Casliber, Achat1999, and Extrapolaris: I think the hook, which deals with average, estimated weights, could be improved, how about:
  • ALT1 ... that one specimen of Vorombe titan, an extinct elephant bird from Madagascar and the heaviest known bird, was estimated to weigh 860 kg (1,900 lb)? Cwmhiraeth (talk) 05:31, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
A good suggestion, but it reads as the weight of the specimen. cygnis insignis 04:42, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
Good point. How about:
  • ALT2 ... that one individual Vorombe titan, an extinct elephant bird from Madagascar and the heaviest known bird species, was estimated to have weighed 860 kg (1,900 lb)? Cwmhiraeth (talk) 07:04, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
Even better, I would have arrived from a different perspective and suggested, "ALT3...that the heaviest bird, known from a specimen of the extinct Madagascan species Vorombe titan, was estimated to have weighed 860 kg (1,900 lb)?cygnis insignis 11:25, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
I have labelled your suggestion as ALT3, but I don't think it will do because this individual bird is estimated to have been larger than any other known specimen. I think it may be better to look at a different aspect such as
I think that is what it says, but now I like this one … punchier, and more likely to get the reader to click through. 16:20, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 2


  • ... that EXAI offers website conversion to make mobile friendly websites for Google's Mobile First Indexing? Source: "Since google announced Mobile First Indexing in November 2016, EXAI started working on a solution that will provide millions of business around the world with a mobile friendly version of their website." ([6])

Created by Lihaas (talk). Self-nominated at 23:43, 2 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Personally, I do not consider this sufficiently interesting for DYK. Catrìona (talk) 00:29, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
Suggest an altu blurb?Lihaas (talk) 03:01, 3 October 2018 (UTC)
  • A drive by comment, and not wishing to give offense, although I probably will: I am not convinced that the grammar and use of English in this article is up to being in Wikipedia's "shop window". I stopped by to see if I could come up with a hookier hook, but in several places I was honestly unsure what was being communicated.
Could I suggest a thorough copy edit. A possibility re this is a GOCE Request. Gog the Mild (talk) 16:56, 4 October 2018 (UTC)
@Gog the Mild: What part, by example, can you suggest is deficient?Lihaas (talk) 04:42, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Honestly the article looks fine to me right now, and the grammar doesn't look too off. My main concern is that the article somewhat reads like a promo piece, and probably needs to be rewritten in a more neutral tone. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:52, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5:In what way do you think it needs a change?Lihaas (talk) 03:41, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
Well for one, I'm not sure if the "novel" should be used here: it sounds like a peacock term to me. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:51, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
Hows this? @Narutolovehinata5:?Lihaas (talk) 12:14, 21 November 2018 (UTC)


  • The article is still somewhat poorly written. For instance, Though the company initially maintained a low-profile it had 15,000 websites created for clients. Did the company or clients "make" the websites? The company sought to use Facebook for business where some companies can choose to feature their local businesses and then convert it to a full website. EXAI however used the reverse model where Facebook pages can be converted by automation into full websites. The way I read this is that EXAI does the exact same thing as Facebook. Make a FB page and then turn that page into a website. It also offers the capability to convert SME websites to a mobile friendly version since Google introduced Mobile First Indexing. Are we supposed to know what SME and Mobile First Indexing means?

    I'd be of the opinion to reject this nomination ("...or else requires considerable work before becoming eligible") given it has been up for over a month and the issues mentioned in the third comment are still yet to be fully resolved. Note that not just the hook has to be ready for the main page. Anarchyte (talk | work) 09:26, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

The Nature of Prejudice

Created by Piotrus (talk). Self-nominated at 11:25, 2 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg -- there is work to do here. For starters, it would be nice to have sections. And the book cover. Second, it needs a copy edit; I made a few obvious ones, but I note that the third paragraph starts with a grammatical error. In the second note the book title needs to be italicized; etc. Oh, the claim in the last sentence needs to be ascribed to someone; we can't be saying it I suppose a summary of the book isn't mandatory, but it would be nice--it's what we expect from a book article. Now, the hook is verified, the article is new enough and long enough and I smell no plagiarism, but it needs serious cleanup. Drmies (talk) 21:56, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Why I don't disagree with you, the issues you are raising are IMHO irrelevant to the DYK (now, if this was a WP:GAN, you'd be dead right). Quality issues like this are not part of the DYK requirements. I am of course happy if people would like to expand things, but I don't believe it is necessary. Btw, I don't see the grammar error. Also, I don't see the need for attribution (the sentence is cited, after all). Lastly, academic books don't have plot summary sections, the content of the book is already summarized. I guess we could add a chapter list? PS. I did add an infobox (through again, it is not required for a DYK; it's not like I am self-assessing this article any higher than start, maybe C-class...). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 07:35, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Piotrus, we've danced this dance before. I'm happy you wrote this up, it's important, but if we're putting it on the front page it should be representative of our quality. The grammar error is in "Describing the book significance"--needs to have a genitive for "book". I didn't say "plot summary", I said summary, and the only thing the article says about the book is the one sentence about some scale. The rest is all caught up inside reviewers' remarks. Having a summary is a Good Thing. I don't care about the infobox, BTW, though lots of people do. And the attribution, that is necessary. That it's cited is beside the point: what matters is that an opinion is cited ("One of the reasons for its success"), and it may be a very reasonable and well-argued opinion, but it's not a fact. Thus, attribution. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 14:16, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Drmies Yes, we danced this indeed, and as I am sure I said it before, your standards are too high for DYK. If you see a grammar error, please fix it. I am not a native speaker and occasionally I don't see them. I stand by what I said - all your other requests, while all beneficial to the article (except the attribution, which I say is not needed through harmless) are not required for this to be on the front page. If you have a problem with that, try changing DYK requirements/guidelines. Ping User:BlueMoonset for 3O. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 05:34, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
    Well, I am not a native speaker either, and I'm not your copyeditor. Yngvadottir, thank you so much for looking over the article, and for the attribution--which of course is necessary, given NPOV. Good day Piotrus. Drmies (talk) 13:50, 17 October 2018 (UTC)

2018 National League Central tie-breaker game, 2018 National League West tie-breaker game

Created by Muboshgu (talk), Spanneraol (talk), Mdumas43073 (talk), and Eposty (talk). Nominated by Muboshgu (talk) at 03:17, 2 October 2018 (UTC).

  • The above noms have redundant highlighted links and WP:EASTEREGGs. I think we should use informative links for the readers as suggested below. Any comments?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:51, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
  • The editing seems to be winding down and limited to the aftermath at this point. However, we now know the aftermath will not conclude until the season is over. I am actually quite shocked that the article is being presented without any mention that the Rockies were going for their first ever NL West title, which is as important as the Dodgers being 5x defending champs.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:14, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
  • I realize that there is a whole featured topic of these to be modeled after, but I think each article should say Team A was going for their Xth National League Division title and Yth National League Foo Division title (if the team has moved divisions like the Cubs) for each team.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:31, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
  • The above are suggestions. However, here is the review:
Both articles are long enough and new enough.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:34, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
I prefer the ALT2 that I have nominated to the other noms and consider this an interesting, well-formed hook.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:38, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
Content is within policy.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:38, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
There are still no QPQ reviews presented.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:41, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
Although I am not sure why, there are no images. It would seem to me that some biographical photos could be included, but I realize there are probably no photos from the game to include.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:43, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
Can we get a citation for "This game was also in fact the first National League divisional tiebreaker ever to not involve the Dodgers."-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:50, 11 October 2018 (UTC)
I don't know who added that sentence, and can't find a source saying that, so I deleted it. I'll do qpq shortly. – Muboshgu (talk) 00:47, 12 October 2018 (UTC)
Isn't there a page somewhere on the internet that lists all NL tie-breaker results historically?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 12:08, 13 October 2018 (UTC)
The best appears to be this. – Muboshgu (talk) 02:02, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
Which points out to me that the statement I removed was false, because the Dodgers were not involved in 1998 National League Wild Card tie-breaker game. – Muboshgu (talk) 02:03, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
I thought divisional tie-breakers and Wild Card tie-breakers were different things. Why would a Wild Card tie-breaker invalidate the prior statement?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:34, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
@TonyTheTiger: I had forgotten about this nom. You're right, it doesn't invalidate it, because of the "divisional" qualifier. But that's too trivial anyway. A tiebreaker is a tiebreaker. – Muboshgu (talk) 22:03, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
@Muboshgu: we are not really tasked with determining what is trivial. We summarize the secondary sources. If they are mentioning it, we should mention it. I consider it significant (but I am a lifelong Dodger fan).-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 14:50, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
@TonyTheTiger: Agreed, but it was a Wikipedia editor who added it and I couldn't find it in secondary sources, which is the reason I removed it. – Muboshgu (talk) 14:57, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 3

Lapa do Santo

View from the rockshelter entrance
View from the rockshelter entrance
  • ALT1 that Lapa do Santo, in Minas Gerais, Brazil, has evidence of human occupation around 12,000 years ago, as well as the oldest recorded case of decapitation in the Americas? Source: [8] [9]
Reviewed The Sensorites

Created by Strauss MAE-USP (talk). Nominated by Mike Peel (talk) at 21:51, 3 October 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg epicgenius (talk) 01:15, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

@Epicgenius: Thanks for the review. Can you have another look? I've proposed a longer hook, ALT1, above. @Strauss MAE-USP: has added references. The similar phrases look minimal to me, are there particular ones you think need rewriting? Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 22:58, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
@Strauss MAE-USP and Mike Peel: ALT1 looks much better. I definitely might be interested by the first recorded decapitation in the Americas. So you have my thumbs up for that one. I really only have three concerns with copyvios, and here they are:
  • "the reduction of the body by means of mutilation, defleshing, tooth removal, exposure to fire and possibly cannibalism, followed by the secondary burial of the remains according to strict rules" - possibly unattributed direct quote
  • "the oldest case of decapitation in the New World" and "were filled with disarticulated bones of a single" - these phrases are too close to the quoted text, even a paraphrase would be good.
  • "three distinct periods of human occupation" - same as above from this source.
That's all of the phrases I was concerned about. Now for the sourcing:
  • "The rockshelter and the archaeological site" doesn't have any sources. A general rule of thumb is to aim for at least one source per paragraph.
  • "Mobility" still doesn't have any sources.
  • The ends of many paragraphs don't have sources. In some cases only the first sentence has a source. On the other hand, all of the references look reliable and authoritative. My issue is with the placement of the sources. Could you move them to the end of the paragraph?
That's all of the outstanding DYK issues. Now going off on a few personal style nitpicks:
  • Although not necessary, I'd also suggest cleaning up this article to comply with some MOS guidelines. For instance, putting the periods before the references.
  • I'm concerned that there are way too many images in this article (there are 231 in total, but only about 4 thumbnail images, the rest are in galleries). WP:NOTGALLERY. Have you considered creating a gallery on Commons?
Sorry to bother you with all these issues. I know it sounds like a lot, but from the looks of it, this article probably does not need that many modifications to get it into good shape for DYK. On a personal note, I am impressed by Strauss MAE-USP's work on this article with over 25 kB of prose size. Maybe this can be nominated as a good article later. epicgenius (talk) 17:59, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
@Epicgenius: sorry for the delay in following this up. I've sorted out the copyvio issues, and quickly checked through the style formatting. I don't think that a gallery on commons would be useful (they fell out of style on Commons quite a while back now), although I'd agree that there are too many pictures here right now. I started this nom after seeing @Strauss MAE-USP's work here, I don't know the subject myself, so I can't help with improving the referencing so much. Maybe @Joalpe: can help there? Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 06:51, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
@Mike Peel: It's OK. I'm still monitoring this nomination. So far it doesn't look like there has been much activity on the page since I last commented. I'll give it a few more weeks before I ask someone else to look at this. epicgenius (talk) 14:02, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
@Mike Peel, Strauss MAE-USP, and Joalpe: Has there been any progress on this article? I know that the comments above might seem like a lot, but there are really only three or four outstanding issues. Otherwise I'm going to ask for another reviewer's opinion. epicgenius (talk) 01:43, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

Oswald Boelcke

  • ... that Oswald Boelcke is considered "the father of air combat"? Source: "Oswald Boelcke did not invent air-to-air tactics, the squadron organizational system, or the German Air Force. Still, his contributions to air warfare are so profound, he is considered the father of all three."
  • ALT1: ... that Oswald Boelcke is considered the father of air combat tactics, the organization of squadrons, and the German Air Force?

Source: "Oswald Boelcke did not invent air-to-air tactics, the squadron organizational system, or the German Air Force. Still, his contributions to air warfare are so profound, he is considered the father of all three." The title of the major source for this article is "Oswald Boelcke: Germany's First Fighter Ace and Father of Air Combat", and the entirety of the book is devoted toward proving this point.

Improved to Good Article status by Georgejdorner (talk) and Peacemaker67 (talk). Nominated by Georgejdorner (talk) at 13:35, 3 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg The source provided does not actually include the quote "the father of air combat". Catrìona (talk) 06:49, 7 October 2018 (UTC)
    • The title of the major source for this article is "Oswald Boelcke: Germany's First Fighter Ace and Father of Air Combat", and the entirety of the book is devoted toward proving this point.Georgejdorner (talk) 15:21, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 5

Muhammad Tapar's anti-Nizari campaign

  • ... that Seljuk sultan Muhammad Tapar's campaign against the outnumbered Nizari Ismailis (the Assassins) eventually failed after a decade of war? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

Created by ZxxZxxZ (talk). Self-nominated at 18:25, 9 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg - article needs expansion. Still too short. And another source or two are needed as well. If that gets fixed please ping me. And I will give a final review.BabbaQ (talk) 22:21, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Note: the article currently has 888 prose characters and needs to be at least 1500 prose characters, so it needs to add over two-thirds to its present size in order to qualify for DYK. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:51, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
It has been 2 weeks since the last notice, and nothing has been done to expand this article. If no action is taken within 7 days, this nomination will be closed as unsuccessful. Yoninah (talk) 19:59, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 6

Sheng Zhongguo

Created by Zanhe (talk). Self-nominated at 07:32, 11 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg New enough, long enough, well written, and properly sourced. QPQ done. But Earwig found what looks to me like too much close paraphrasing from https://www.thestrad.com/chinese-violinist-zhongguo-sheng-dies-aged-77/8174.article (e.g. source for the hook claim "In 1980 the Australian Broadcasting Corporation listed him as one of ‘the world’s greatest artists" vs our article changed only from active to passive "In 1980, he was listed by the Australian Broadcasting Corporation as one of the world's greatest artists.") and from http://en.chinaculture.org/library/2008-01/11/content_43033.htm (source: "His father, Sheng Xue, was a famous violinist and professor who taught at the Central Conservatory of Music and Nanjing Arts Institute. His mother, Zhu Bing, majored in vocal music."; our article, "His father, Sheng Xue, was a well known violinist and professor of Central Conservatory of Music and Nanjing Arts Institute. His mother Zhu Bing was a vocalist.") And the incredibly boring hook conveys no useful information about the subject and probably violates WP:PEACOCK. Can't we find something more distinctive to say about him than "he played really well"? —David Eppstein (talk) 20:31, 11 October 2018 (UTC)
@David Eppstein: Thanks for your review. The close paraphrasing is mainly of proper names and set phrases. I've put "one of the world's greatest artists" in quotation marks and edited the other sentence as well, please check again. I disagree with your "peacock" comment. WP:PEACOCK refers to "Words such as these are often used without attribution" while the hook is clearly attributed. In fact, WP:PEACOCK uses the sentence "Dylan was included in Time's 100: The Most Important People of the Century" as an example of factual statements. And there's a huge difference between playing well and being named by a major broadcaster as one of the world's greatest artists, an honour that is prominently mentioned by most of his obituaries. I can't imagine how you can treat them as the same. -Zanhe (talk) 23:03, 11 October 2018 (UTC)
So you disagree that the close paraphrasing that I specifically identified is a problem and that the bad hook is bad. I suppose that's a response, but it's not one that's going to lead me to pass your hook. —David Eppstein (talk) 23:08, 11 October 2018 (UTC)
I thought I addressed the close paraphrasing issue with edits including putting the set phrase in quotes. I disagreed with your assessment of the hook as uninteresting/peacock. Please read my reasoning and reconsider. -Zanhe (talk) 23:20, 11 October 2018 (UTC)
The problem is not the set phrase, it is that you are constructing the article by taking sentences from the source and making minor changes to individual words while repeating the same concepts in the same order. That is close paraphrasing and it is not ok. You need to internalize the concepts involved and then present them in your own order, in your own language, not merely by making cosmetic changes to someone else's writing. —David Eppstein (talk) 01:15, 12 October 2018 (UTC)
The sentences highlighted by Earwig were made of long proper names and phrases strung together with simple words. I've further edited the article and deleted some info ("professor of Central Conservatory of Music and Nanjing Arts Institute") which I don't think I can paraphrase further without making it sound unnatural. Earwig now reports 5.7%. Please check again. Thanks. -Zanhe (talk) 03:25, 12 October 2018 (UTC)
@David Eppstein: I've edited the article to address your concerns. Did you see my message from a week ago? -Zanhe (talk) 21:59, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
It still seems very similar to the sources to me and you still haven't proposed an interesting-enough hook. —David Eppstein (talk) 22:16, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
Symbol redirect vote 4.svg It appears we're in disagreement. Requesting third opinion. -Zanhe (talk) 22:25, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
Comment: An article may be passed by Earwig and still be full of close paraphrasing/copyvio. Otherwise we'd rely on the tool and have no need for time-consuming checks by human editors. – Reidgreg (talk) 18:50, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 8

Tawasa people

  • ... that "The Account of Lamhatty" was a document created by a man of the Tawasa people, named Lamhatty? Source: Bushnell, David (1908). The Account of Lamhatty.

Created/expanded by Amay1355 (talk). Self-nominated at 17:03, 15 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Amay1355, the moment you work on that particular section a bit, you'll be able to write something more exciting. This hook generates no interest, since there is no reason to think it unusual that a man named X made a document named "the account of X". You have to start thinking about what is interesting or exciting about this--for other readers. Dr Aaij (talk) 00:39, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

Slovak Three

  • ... that in June 2001, three members of the Real IRA tried to buy arms from Iraq, promising the men they thought were Iraqi Intelligence that their use against Britain would "bring a smile to your face"? Source: For the RIRA negotiating with Iraq, Barrett, R.; Parker, P. (2018) "Acting Ethically in the Shadows: Intelligence Gathering and Human Rights", in Nowak M. Using Human Rights to Counter Terrorism, Cheltenham: Edward Elgar Publishing; for MI5 impersonating Iraqi Intelligence, Clarke, L. (25 June 2006) "Sting by security services foils renewed Real IRA campaign", The Times; for the quote, Steele, J. (8 May 2002) "Real IRA men snared by MI5 given 30 years", The Daily Telegraph.
    • ALT1:... that in 2001, members of the Real IRA attempted to buy arms from MI5 agents, believing them to be Iraqi gunrunners, and wrote their list on a napkin which an agent blew his nose on before pocketing? For the gunrunning &Iraqi connection, Barrett & Parker, and Clarke, per ALT0; for the nose-blowing, etc, Johnston, P. (3 May 2002) "Tip-off that set up Real IRA 'Arab sting'", The Daily Telegraph.

Created by Serial Number 54129 (talk). Self-nominated at 17:57, 8 October 2018 (UTC).

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Green tickY
  • Interesting: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Red XN - I think shorter hooks would be more effective. Just my 2c.
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Well written, well over required length, excellent DYK material. Catrìona (talk) 02:05, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

@Serial Number 54129: New, shorter hooks needed per reviewer's request. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:08, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

Einsatzgruppe H, Hlinka Guard Emergency Divisions, Kremnička and Nemecká massacres

* ... that Einsatzkommando 14 and local collaborators committed the two most notorious massacres in the history of Slovakia? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

    • ALT1:... that Einsatzkommando 14 and local collaborators committed the two largest massacres in the history of Slovakia?
    • In case three articles in one hook is too many, we could also go with:
      • ALT2a: ... that "Slovaks killed Slovaks" during the two largest massacres in the history of Slovakia? Source: Title of this article, Schön, Jozef (16 March 2017). "Keď Slovák vraždil Slováka". Hnonline (in Slovak). "When Slovaks killed Slovaks"
      • ALT2b: ... that along with murdering or deporting thousands of Jews and Romani people, Einsatzgruppe H targeted German soldiers suspected of defeatism and homosexuality?

Created by Catrìona (talk). Self-nominated at 08:39, 8 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Comment I'm fairly sure for three bolded links you need 3 reviews, or am I wrong? Juxlos (talk) 13:49, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment Where are the source texts for hooks requested in the nomination form?Georgejdorner (talk) 18:36, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
@Juxlos: You're correct, that's in the supplementary rules and I wasn't aware of it. plus Added. @Georgejdorner: It is not actually a requirement to quote sources, as long as they are cited in the article (which these are, see then end of Kremnička and Nemecká massacres). The reason why I commented on your hook is that it was odd to include a quote that did not actually support the proposed hook. There is actually no source describing the massacres as "notorious" simply because almost all sources are non-English, but being described as the "Slovak Katyn" and similar means that it's reasonable to conclude that this is the general view on the massacres in Slovakia. Catrìona (talk) 01:55, 9 October 2018 (UTC)
Thank you for the comment on my nom. It aided me in writing an improved hook.
I made the comments above about sourcing so you might correct the problems before you are reviewed. As your own nomination form states above (where you failed to give a source), "Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)" Hooks ALT1 and ALT2b have no sourcing whatsoever. A lenient reviewer might let you slide on ALT2a.
And, yes, I recall when mentioning your cite without a link or quote was acceptable here in DYK, but times have changed.
Best regards.Georgejdorner (talk) 02:00, 13 October 2018 (UTC)
@Georgejdorner: I don't understand your emphasis on putting the sources in the hook nomination. The most important thing is that the hook facts are cited in the article, per WP:DYK#Eligibility criteria 3. Cited hook. Yoninah (talk) 13:46, 31 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment: I haven't seen a link to somewhere in the middle of a bolded article, and think it's not a good idea, - found it confusing. - And yes, 3 qpq reviews please. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:48, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
@Gerda Arendt: Thanks for your comment. There are 3 qpqs listed above. How about:
      • ALT3a: ... that Slovak collaborators participated in the two largest massacres in Slovakia during World War II? Rajcan, Vanda; Vadkerty, Madeline; Hlavinka, Ján (2018). "Slovakia". In Megargee, Geoffrey P.; White, Joseph R.; Hecker, Mel. Camps and Ghettos under European Regimes Aligned with Nazi Germany. Encyclopedia of Camps and Ghettos. 3. United States Holocaust Memorial Museum. ISBN 978-0-253-02373-5. p. 849
      • ALT3b: ... that along with murdering or deporting thousands of Jews and Romani people, Einsatzgruppe H targeted German soldiers suspected of defeatism and homosexuality? Šindelářová, Lenka (2013). "Einsatzgruppe H na povstaleckém Slovensku". Soudobé dějiny (in Czech). Prague. XX (4): 582–603. ISSN 1210-7050. p. 588 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Catrìona (talkcontribs) 08:48, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Full review needed now that new ALT hooks have been provided. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:43, 29 October 2018 (UTC)
  • It appears that this is a November 5 date request and it is November 2. No one seems to want to take on this review, so I might as well.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:50, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
  • First, let's get these nominations into one hook. Based on the WP:LEAD of Hlinka Guard Emergency Divisions you could go with the following, although I have to take a look at the sources and make sure it is backed up:
  • ALT4... that the Hlinka Guard Emergency Divisions were known for there crimes against humanity in the Kremnička and Nemecká massacres in conjuction with Einsatzgruppe H?--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:07, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
@TonyTheTiger: Thanks for taking on this review. Your proposed hook is factually correct, except as far as I know "crimes against humanity" as a legal matter was not used to charge any of the perpetrators. It would be more accurate to say that Einsatzgruppe H sponsored the massacre, and the Hlinka Guard Emergency Divisions was drafted into helping them. However, after writing this I decided that trying to shoehorn the three articles into one hook wasn't as effective as separating them into two hooks; see above. The special occasion date (for the hook mentioning the Kremnicka/Nemecka massacres) doesn't have to be 5 November; it would be equally appropriate to have it on 20 November, 12 or 19 December, 4, 5, 11, or 20 January, or 19 February (the massacres took place on multiple days). Catrìona (talk) 05:19, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
  1. @TonyTheTiger: I don't think that ALT4 is a good hook. So what if the two units were involved in a massacre? It doesn't give the reader any reason to click any of the links. Whereas, that Slovak collaborators were involved in the largest massacres on Slovak soil, that is noteworthy and interesting, and so is the fact that Einsatzgruppe H also targeted their own men.
  2. They're separate articles on the Czech and Slovak wikis, but I thought it made more sense to keep them in the same article since most sources discuss them together. The massacres involved the same perpetrators and victims, took place at the same location and with the same motivation. The victims had even been arrested in the same way and were taken from the same prison. According to one source, the perpetrators decided to switch the site of killings from Kremnicka to Nemecka because they ran out of space in the anti-tank ditches. (The Katyn massacre also took place in multiple locations.) Catrìona (talk) 05:44, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
  • TonyTheTiger, I don't see that you've yet given this review an icon. Even if there is still more to do, in a review this long, it's important to let the nominator and others to know its current status. Thank you. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:56, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg This set of articles is pretty close. However, I am a bit troubled by the merger of two articles here that seem to be separate articles in other wikis that are culturally closer to the subject. I sort of view the Czech and Slovak wikis as the place where the subject matter experts are. If they view these as separate topics, why should we have a merged article. I am open to outside opinions on this matter, but encourage considering splitting the articles. I also mentioned an issue with alternate wikis in the text following a redlink. We can revisit the hooks, when we resolve the article merge/split issue.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:15, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
@TonyTheTiger: Personally, I think it's odd that you would consider the Czech and Slovak wikis as definitive, given that the articles you are talking about (both Czech and Slovak) have no citations at all. Also, you haven't advanced a proposal or much of any argument why separating the articles would be beneficial. Currently, the article is independently rated B-class but it would probably be stub- or start-class if split. As for interlanguage links, a specific template exists for this purpose, and is widely used all over Wikipedia. If you don't like it, you should nominate the template for deletion. Catrìona (talk) 06:15, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
Honestly, I don't know what interlanguage link templates are suppose to be used for. I have met with great resistance in my editorial experience. I have also never chanced upon one in article space, to my recollection. That being said, my calling in to question whether they meet core policies and guidelines is one of the few things I am suppose to check according to the review criteria here at DYK and has nothing to do with whether an article should be at WP:AFD, which is a notability judgement. Without digging through policy, I thought we might jointly determine that it was something that needed to be rectified. I may have to dig through interwiki link policy. In regard to the split/merge, I don't judge foreign wikis for verifiability. En Wiki did not start enforcing verifiability until it got well past 1 million articles.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 16:26, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 9

Super League XXIV

  • ... that the London Broncos will play in rugby league's Super League XXIV in a rugby union stadium smaller than RFL standards? Source: Sky Sports

Created by L1amw90 (talk) and The C of E (talk). Nominated by The C of E (talk) at 07:17, 11 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg @The C of E: I don't see how this hook is interesting to a broad audience. It's not that uncommon for sports teams to play games in smaller-than-normal stadiums (like DC United's occasional home games in Maryland, Seattle Sounders FC sometimes playing in its training ground, or the Los Angeles Chargers playing at a soccer-specific stadium). In addition, I feel that the hook is not interesting to non-rugby fans, and as far as I am aware, it's not uncommon for stadiums to host both union and league, and in any case the hook feels rambling. How about something simply something like "the London Broncos will play their rugby league game at a rugby union stadium?" or something to that effect? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 12:09, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Narutolovehinata5: No, I think that this hook has sufficient interest and I don't see any reason to change it. I think the general public might find it interesting in that there will be a club that has allowed to play their matches in a stadium smaller than the league's regulations. indeed your proposed alt is basically the same as my original just without the mention of that fact so I am happy to stick with the one I have proposed. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 15:15, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
I'm afraid your proposed hook is not interesting to a broad audience. Like audiences wouldn't really care about stadium sizes and the like; I'm pretty sure we've discussed something similar to this before. And in many parts of the world, smaller stadiums are the norm, not the exception. Perhaps if the RFL was a well-known league worldwide like the NFL, the Premiere League, or the IPL, but the RFL is much more niche. As such, I've gone ahead and struck the hook. Also, I'd also like to ask the opinions of fellow sports article contributor Hawkeye7 on their thoughts on both the article and the hook. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:04, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
I disagree, I think the hook is fine as it is and as I mentioned above your proposal is exactly the same as the original (less the reference to size) so what is the difference. I'm not prepared to change it at this so have unstruck it for another reviewer. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 05:32, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
Once a hook has been struck, it can't normally be unstruck by the nominator, only by a reviewer; I have re-struck the hook, please do not unstrike unless me, Hawkeye7, or another editor says so. I'd wait for a second opinion here on whether or not it's appropriate, but for now, a new hook is needed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 06:16, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
I think you'll find that under WP:DYKRULES, there is no such rule that says that. As such, I am unstriking and prepared to wait for a new reviewer. It is certainly appropriate as it is accurate and sourced inline in the article. Subjective opinions on if it is interesting are irrelevant. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 15:12, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
You may wish to read the comment left by BlueMoonset on Template:Did you know nominations/Sun of Unclouded Righteousness, specifically the quote he certainly should not be unstriking any hook struck by a reviewer. With that said, I will request a second review over a WT:DYK on hook interest and will leave the hook unstruck for now while waiting for other opinions. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 15:38, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
Boring hook. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:32, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg Adding an icon reflective of a nomination without an unstruck hook. If The C of E doesn't wish to provide a new hook, then they can always withdraw the nomination. No one gets to insist on keeping their hook in the face of reviewer agreement that there are problems with it. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:25, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
  • The issue here is that it is going to be very difficult to find an interesting hook when there is so little information in the article other than the utterly routine stuff such as the format of the league and the teams in it - hardly surprising as the season hasn’t even started yet. Pawnkingthree (talk) 01:31, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
@BlueMoonset and Pawnkingthree: Per discussions on Discord and reading through the article again, would this work?
ALT1 ... that rugby league's Super League XXIV will feature a top five play-offs system?" Apparently such systems aren't actually unusual in rugby (given that the format has an article), but as a non-rugby fan, I kind of found that fact interesting since most playoff formats involve an even number of teams. Thoughts? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:42, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
Let's go with ALT1. Top five playoffs are fairly common in Australia, but unusual elsewhere. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 02:01, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
Narutolovehinata5, Hawkeye7, source 3 appears to be talking about the top five playoffs system being reintroduced for promotion of one Championship League team to the Super League at the end of a season (taking the place of the Super League team with the worst record, which is relegated to the Championship League). So ALT1 is not properly sourced. The Championship League had an eight-team playoff through 2018; Super League abandoned their eight-team playoff in 2015 for a four-team playoff system if one is to believe the Super League play-offs article. That same article notes that the top five system was used from 1998 through 2001, and that fact, if it can be supported (no sourcing in the article), might make a good hook:
Reading between the lines of the Super League play-offs article, 1998 was the year of Super League III, the first year there were playoffs in Super League, and it was the top-five version that's being used anew in 2019. Again, if sourcing can be found (the only source used for Super League III is behind a paywall, and I can't check it), an even more interesting hook would be possible:
Would someone know where to find the necessary sourcing and be able to make the necessary additions to the article for these hooks to be supported, assuming they're deemed interesting enough? BlueMoonset (talk) 02:41, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
So the playing in another club's ground with permission is more boring than the playoff format? I'd have thought that would have had even less of a "broad" reach plus I find them boring therefore I do not accept these proposals so I am striking them. I am prepared to amend my hook by adding a geographical indicator to make it more "interesting":
ALT4 ... that the London Broncos will play in rugby league's predominately Northern England based Super League XXIV in a rugby union stadium smaller than RFL standards? The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 12:48, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
  • That does not make the hook any more interesting in my opinion. The ALT2 and ALT3 are marginally better. Pawnkingthree (talk) 12:59, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
The C of E, I am very aware that you really want to stick with your proposal on stadium size, but multiple reviewers here have already stated that it is not a good option. ALT4 is just as bland as the original and arguably even more inaccessible, because let's face it, the average reader is unlikely to be one that cares about RFL standards or Northern England. I am unstriking ALT2 and ALT3 and have struck ALT4 as not addressing reviewer concerns; please do not revert unless told to by a reviewer, as this is considered going against reviewer consensus. Symbol redirect vote 4.svg I will also make a request at WT:DYK for an uninvolved editor to make the full review here. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 15:35, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
ALT5 ... that London Broncos defeated Toronto Wolfpack to earn promotion to the mostly Northern England based Super League XXIV? The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 15:51, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
I'm afraid that's not really a good hook either, although it's probably a better option than ALT0 and ALT4. The problem is that promotion and relegation isn't unusual at all and most readers would be unfamiliar with either team. With that said, the opinions of previous reviewers @Pawnkingthree, BlueMoonset, Hawkeye7, and The Rambling Man: would still be appreciated here, since this is a new proposal. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 15:55, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Fail. There's nothing interesting in a league that's yet to start, no matter how contrived anyone tries to make it. Send in Vanamonde93 to find something here given he's solely in charge of what is and what is not interesting, despite allowing dozens of hooks go through to the main page, including those which are on the main page today, apart from just one that I was involved with. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:51, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    This is getting rather tiresome: there was absolutely no cause to ping me here. I have pulled hooks for reasons of interest on several occasions. I do so typically when I promote a prep to queue, or promote a special occasion hook, which is what brought me to your hook. If you think I'm giving you special attention, I'm flattered, but I don't have that sort of time. FTR, the original hook is not interesting to a broad audience. Vanamonde (talk) 21:56, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    Yet this so-called admin who has seen "more football than most" deems other hooks instantly boring? Wow. This may be tiresome, but this is the lot you have chosen. Fail this, and I will continually question Vanamonde93 as to why every boring hook that gets through hasn't been pulled. That's reasonable given the short shrift the hook I proposed was given, yet pulled and then replaced with a bunch of shit, without any kind of apology. Even now. So, that's your lot Vanamonde, deal with it. The Rambling Man (talk) 22:01, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    That makes no sense. I will pull hooks only when I review them at some stage of the process. If you think I ought to check every hook posted to the main page, please think again. Vanamonde (talk) 22:06, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    No, of course, you only check the hooks you read. Revelation. So this hook falls squarely, more squarely, into Vanamonde's "not interesting" loop, and certainly mine too. Fail this nomination, move on. Looking forward to the next revelation from this admin. The Rambling Man (talk) 22:18, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    So you didn't have a good reason to ping me, because I was uninvolved, and you were not asking for my input. Please don't ping me under those circumstances again. Vanamonde (talk) 22:22, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    Please don't act unilaterally against consensus and introduce errors at the last moment. Please approach DYK consistently. Please try harder. The Rambling Man (talk) 08:44, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
  • I agree with TRM that there is fundamentally nothing interesting that can be said about a league that has yet to start. I don't find the fact that there's one London based team and the rest are northern interesting enough for a broad audience. Not every new article is suitable for DYK and I think this should be failed.Pawnkingthree (talk) 13:05, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
@Pawnkingthree: I disagree. Just because something is new doesn't mean that it can't be suitable for DYK. Yes the league has yet to begin, that doesn't mean something can't be said about it. For example, I actually like the part about that Top 5 playoffs; as mentioned above, it appears to be common in Australia but not elsewhere, and as a sports fan I found it unusual that their playoffs system had an odd number of teams. With that said, I'd like to hear your thoughts on ALT2 and ALT3; if you don't like them, I'd like to hear The C of E's thoughts one more time, and if we can't get into an agreement, I'm willing to fail this. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 21:03, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Sigh* I see I have little choice, I for the life of me cannot see how a hook about a playoff format is more interesting than the fact we had a London team fighting it out with a Canadian team for a place in a mostly Northern competition. I'd still prefer one of my hooks but I regrettably won't object if they use one of the others. It's this sort of thing that made me take a brief hiatus from DYK because I used to enjoy doing it; it relaxed me not stressed me out as it does with this sort of thing. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 18:47, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5: I'm not thrilled about a format-based hook but If you like the playoff suggestions and C of E won't object, it does seem to be the best we have. I would say that ALT 3 is the marginally better one. Pawnkingthree (talk) 19:18, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
Narutolovehinata5, as I pointed out when I suggested the ALT2 and ALT3 hooks, reliable sourcing will need to be found for these facts; some facts and sourcing are not in the article now, nor are the sourced in the various league season articles here on Wikipedia where I found said facts. There hasn't been any attempt to source them in the nominated article, so unless that attempt is made, this could all be moot. BlueMoonset (talk) 21:21, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
Thanks. Please address the sourcing issues so that this can proceed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:11, 4 November 2018 (UTC)
  • The C of E, it's been a week. Last call to address the sourcing issues for those hooks. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 23:22, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I have added a source to it, I still object to this hijacking of the nomination and still feel that one of my original proposed hooks are better because I still do not believe the playoff hook is more interesting than either the stadium or team hooks I proposed. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 08:04, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • The article looks better now and it appears that whatever can be sourced has been sourced. The "Teams" section seems to lack references, but I'm willing to let that pass as long as each statement is verified in each team's article (though to be on the safe side, a single general reference, perhaps to the league's website or an official stats site, could also be added here). The same for the tables, which right now are empty. As for the hook suggestions, it was not a "hijacking" but rather a reflection of consensus; although the stadium size hooks was greatly preferred by the nominator, consensus determined that they were not interesting enough to a broad audience and thus had to be substituted with different proposals. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:55, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

LeCompte maneuver

  • ... that the LeCompte maneuver helps surgeons switch a baby's aorta and pulmonary artery? Source: "Anterior translocation of the pulmonary arteries (PAs) in relation to the aorta was first described by LeCompte in 1981 in his description of a new technique of the arterial switch operation (ASO) for d-transposition of great arteries (TGA)."

5x expanded by Keilana (talk). Self-nominated at 15:24, 9 October 2018 (UTC).

  • General eligiblity:
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol possible vote.svg I'm afraid it's a bit too short for a DYK nomination, but should be salvageable with some more work.

Content-wise, the sentence "cutting the main pulmonary artery and moving it anterior to the aorta before continuing the reconstruction of the great vessels" is not clear. Firstly, the verb "moving" is confusing - does the procedure involve simply pushing the cut end of the main pulmonary artery around or attaching it anterior to the aorta? I'm assuming it's the latter, but the mental image persists. Secondly, this sentence mentions reconstruction of the great vessels, while the next one talks about reconstruction of the right ventricular outflow tract (part of the heart itself, not the vessels). Might be good to clarify.

Other aspects ok. — Yerpo Eh? 12:19, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

@Yerpo: My apologies for taking so long to take care of this - I just finished my inpatient month and am slowly getting around to my real life. Just to clarify, the right ventricular outflow tract must be reconstructed when the PA is reattached to it during an ASO, or any kind of vessel reconstruction that's proximal enough to need a LeCompte configuration. Does that need to be explicitly explained? (I have spent I think I made the rest clear -- and the article is now 1532kb thanks to these clarifications. I'll try to check in asap, I take a massive exam on Friday so I may be less accessible than I would like. Keilana (talk) 14:37, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 10

Edgecliff (Winnetka, Illinois)

  • ... that Edgecliff was the building with the highest residential property tax in Cook County in 2014 and 2015?
  • Comment: I realize that this is not yet 1500 characters. There is a book coming from the Chicago Public Library. I will pick up "North Shore Chicago: Houses of the Lakefront Suburbs, 1890-1940" on the 18th.

Created by TonyTheTiger (talk). Self-nominated at 05:36, 16 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Note: one month later this review still does not have an icon given, which means it is incomplete and not yet eligible for use as a QPQ. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:16, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Questions: Is the home still standing? Is it possible to get a photograph of the house? Flibirigit (talk) 23:14, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Tribulation 99: Alien Anomalies Under America, Spectres of the Spectrum, Mock Up on Mu

Craig Baldwin with his collection of films
Craig Baldwin with his collection of films

Created by Hinnk (talk). Self-nominated at 03:49, 15 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Two of these articles are new and are long enough, but Mock Up on Mu is an expansion. Unfortunately it is not long enough, having been expanded from 826 to 3482 characters, and will need to be over 4100 characters to qualify on length. The image is idiosyncratic and properly licensed and the hook facts are interesting and cited inline in each of the articles. The articles are neutral and I detected no copyright or close paraphrasing issues. For a three article hook you need three QPQ reviews. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 07:07, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

Pachara Chirathivat

Pachara Chirathivat
Pachara Chirathivat
  • ... that while shooting a strangling scene from the 2012 film Countdown, Pachara Chirathivat (pictured) was already suffocating while the crew continued shooting?

5x expanded by 001Jrm (talk). Self-nominated at 21:20, 10 October 2018 (UTC).

  • ALT1: ... that Pachara Chirathivat (pictured) was actually suffocating during a strangling scene in the 2012 film Countdown, but the film crew thought he was just acting? Yoninah (talk) 20:54, 11 November 2018 (UTC)

Doing... starting review for nomination. Flibirigit (talk) 23:17, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - ?
  • Interesting: Green tickY
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Prose count on October 3 (not including charts and infobox) = 1239, as of October 10 = 6170, there the readable word count was expanded five times. Check versions in other languages, and no copying issues found. Citations are needed for the filmography, discography, and videography sections. Close paraphrasing found here In the philanthropy section, please reword "in the final stages of brain cancer", and use a more complete quotation formatting for the other two attributed quotes. There are two closely paraphrased sections from here. Hooks are discussed in the article, but a source needs to be cut and paste into this nomination for a transparent review. Some other non-critical suggestions are adding more categories, and expanding the lead section to summarize all parts of the article. Flibirigit (talk) 23:40, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 11

Wolfgang Rennert

  • Reviewed: to come Black-collared starling
  • Comment: Confession: we are late, I forgot that LouisAlain created this already on 11 October. There would be enough material for more expansion, but it seems a bit unfair to other great conductors. IRA, please?

Created by LouisAlain (talk) and Gerda Arendt (talk). Nominated by Gerda Arendt (talk) at 13:53, 20 October 2018 (UTC).

  • I think this could be accepted per IAR, but the hook doesn't really seem interesting to a broad audience. Non-opera fans probably can't appreciate how conducting at the Frankfurt Opera is a big deal. Perhaps another hook can be suggested here, more about his actual work? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 02:11, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
They can nonetheless be astonished that someone was working in both West and East then, and conducted several premieres, and on the side learn about the Franfurt Opera, which has been named Opera house of the year just as often as the three operas in Berlin together, including 2018. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:49, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
Gerda Arendt - I have no problem accepting this as being a touch late, but do agree that this hook might be a bit narrowly focused. Perhaps an ALT incorporating this happening during the Cold War and that Rennert worked in both East and West Germany? Best, Mifter (talk) 05:32, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
Well, I hate to mention war all the time, I think East and West Germany are no good names for the political situation, and Fram will come (as for Leininger, where we tried to explain something to clarify the hook), saying the source doesn't mention this. Rennert was a creative person, not a politician. I believe that mentioning East Berlin says enough. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:04, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Helen Hays (ornithologist)

Helen Hays on Great Gull Island
Helen Hays on Great Gull Island
  • ... that since 1969, ornithologist Helen Hays (pictured) has lived half the year on an island owned by American Museum of Natural History? Source: "[T]he American Museum of Natural History bought the old fort and asked [Hays] to pay a visit...Working out of the old barracks, she and a handful of volunteers are the only ones living here six months a year." CBS News "Ms. Hays, who since 1969 has lived on the island six months a year" NYT
    • ALT1:... that in the half-century of ornithologist Helen Hays's (pictured) conservation work, the near-extinct tern population of Great Gull Island increased tenfold? Source: "The terns were on the verge of extinction. Hunters seeking their beautiful feathers for hats decimated the population in the early 20th century. As few as 2,500 birds remained...Today their numbers are thriving: some 26,000 terns are on the island" CBS News
    • ALT2:... that across a half-century of conservation work by ornithologist Helen Hays (pictured), the near-extinct tern population of Great Gull Island increased tenfold? Source: "The terns were on the verge of extinction. Hunters seeking their beautiful feathers for hats decimated the population in the early 20th century. As few as 2,500 birds remained...Today their numbers are thriving: some 26,000 terns are on the island" CBS News

Created by The lorax (talk) and Innisfree987 (talk). Nominated by Innisfree987 (talk) at 05:11, 18 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Interesting life, on good sources, no copyvio obvious. The image is licensed, but a little "restless" in small size, it also shows no island but interior. I'd prefer ALT1 (not just living somewhere but results!), but please reword it in a way without possessive followed by the pictured-clause, best no possessive at all but her active ;) - Also waiting for qpq. - Suggestions for the article: find a way to have the link to Island before the committee, and mention what ALT1 says in the lead. Try to avoid one-sentence paragraphs, and merge the Manhattan sence to somewhere else, - doesn't deserve its own para ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:23, 18 October 2018 (UTC)
Thanks so much for all the feedback, Gerda Arendt. I've revised the hook, see if it seems better? I'm fine leaving off the picture if folks think it's not up to snuff, just wanted to note it's available. Next to turn to your suggestions for the entry, thanks again. Innisfree987 (talk) 03:43, 4 November 2018 (UTC)
Just to say, article now revised per suggestions as well. Thanks again for the input, I really think it improved the entry (I hope you'll think so too--please feel free to change anything you think could be done better, of course!) Innisfree987 (talk) 06:13, 4 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Please do not include the word "extinct" when describing historical population statuses of either common terns or roseate terns. Terms such as "near-extinct" and "verge of extinction" are factually incorrect and result only from hyperbole/misunderstanding by the CBS journalist. North American roseate tern populations were indeed devastated by the millinery trade in the nineteenth century and were saved only by the Migratory Bird Treaty Act of 1918. North-eastern US populations rebounded until 1930, when the rising presence of humans increased predation by racoons and other animals. While regionally the terns were certainly threatened with extirpation, as a species with a global distribution, their survival has never been threatened. The IUCN Red List assessments only date back to 1988, where roseate terns were listed as "near threatened". Common terns are much more abundant and have never been at risk. Loopy30 (talk) 12:35, 18 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Could we simply drop the term? A tenfold increase seems impressive enough to me. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:38, 18 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Certainly! I had already corrected the article text to remove the term and did not want the DYK to be published with the same error. A tenfold increase (locally though, not globally!) is especially impressive because it occurred at a time when other regional breeding pair populations were still in decline. Loopy30 (talk) 12:57, 18 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Just to be clear, the hook as well as the sources refer to the risk of extinction of this colony, not the worldwide species. But I'm fine with not using the word extinction if some prefer. Innisfree987 (talk) 03:36, 4 November 2018 (UTC)
  • The article looks good in its present state and Hays is an interesting subject for a DYK. The objection to the term "locally extinct" is that it is an oxymoron and similar to saying that someone is "half-pregnant". A species cannot be both locally extant (elsewhere) and extinct, the correct term for this would be "extirpated". The most reliable (specialized) sources are clear on this, even if a (generally) reliable popular press source gets it confused. Loopy30 (talk) 13:46, 4 November 2018 (UTC)

Miluj blížneho svojho

  • ... that an antisemitic and antiziganistic statement had to be censored from a Slovak documentary about a post-Holocaust pogrom? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)
    • ALT1:... that Dušan Hudec criticized the removal of an antisemitic and antiziganistic statement from his film, which connected a post-Holocaust pogrom to modern-day Slovak racism?
    • ALT2:... that Slovak Jewish leaders criticized the removal of an antisemitic statement from a documentary about a post-Holocaust pogrom?
    • ALT3 ... that during the filming of a documentary about the 1945 Topoľčany pogrom, a local man stated that "Jews and Gypsies are the worst scum under the sun"?

Created by Catrìona (talk). Self-nominated at 15:52, 11 October 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on October 12

Fernando Albán Salazar

  • ... that the devout Catholic faith of Fernando Albán Salazar is primary evidence cited by family, friends, colleagues, and bishops, as a reason to not believe the story of his apparent suicide? Source: "Also expressing concern was Venezuela’s Catholic bishops’ conference and Luis Almagro, the head of the Organization of American States and a sharp critic of Venezuela’s government. [...]Friends said the councilman was a family man and devout Catholic. “Albán is a very Christian person, with deep spiritual convictions that go contrary to a decision to take one’s life,” said Joel Garcia, a lawyer who met with Mr. Albán the night before in the tribunal, and said he seemed calm." (New York Times)
    • ALT1:... that though Fernando Albán Salazar is from Colombia, he chose to become a politician in Venezuela? Source: "nació en Colombia, ahora bien, para optar al cargo de concejal" (NTN24) - Spanish

Created by Jamez42 (talk) and Kingsif (talk). Nominated by Kingsif (talk) at 22:17, 20 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Comment: I have to mention that the main description is half true since there are other reasons given for not believing suicide as the cause of death, including the differences of the versions given between the Attorney General and the Interior Minister, the fact that there weren't open windows in the tenth floor of the building, that Fernando was likely handcuffed at the moment, among others. I support the alternative nomination.

Articles created/expanded on October 13

Government of NCT of Delhi v. Union of India

Building of the Supreme Court of India
Building of the Supreme Court of India
  • Reviewed: I don't think it's needed now; less than five DYK credits (four three).
  • Comment: Created in userspace on 26 September 2018 and moved to mainspace on 13 October 2018.

Created by SshibumXZ (talk). Self-nominated at 00:52, 18 October 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on October 14

Sophie Koch

Created by LouisAlain (talk) and Gerda Arendt (talk). Nominated by Gerda Arendt (talk) at 11:18, 21 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Claiming this for review. The full review will be to follow. The proposed hook I suppose is somewhat interesting, but I'm not sure if non-opera fans will like it. I note that the article states she began performing opera at the age of 11; is that unusual in opera? Because personally I think that performing opera at such a young age is interesting to a broad audience. Secondly, the sentence "Sophie Koch is a patron of the Coline Opera Endowment Fund." and much of the Discography section is unreferenced. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:58, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Thank you for looking. Beginning young is not unusual, and nothing about her. - Becoming internationally known, without what follows, should be enough for the not so operatic ;) - LouisAlain, can you take care of the facts for which I couldn't find a reference? Reference or remove, that is the question. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:46, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
Gerda, if you couldn't get refs as pertains the discography, there's no way I could, so my suggestion is to mask the whole discography section unless someone is ready to search through the different record labels catalogues. Is it worth the pain for a DYK article?
I was in a rush and only saw the endowment fund. I will take care of the discopgraphy, but don't know when. Am on vacation. just returned after a day out, and after dinner will today's article. Patience please. - I will never understand why published books and recordings - which are in authority control (in national libraries, among others) - also need a reference. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:52, 2 November 2018 (UTC)

Same here. But 'never' say "never" nor "always" Face-wink.svg LouisAlain (talk) 23:28, 2 November 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for the reminder, I forgot over vacation. Later today, or tomorrow, or ping me again. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:05, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
Narutolovehinata5, I referenced the recordings, and dropped the one line without ref. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:36, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
ALT1: ... that mezzo-soprano Sophie Koch made her Metropolitan Opera debut as Charlotte in Massenet's Werther?
The Met is probably better known, but the ROH is the better article. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:41, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
Honestly I'm not sure about ALT1, as it assumes familiarity with Werther, which most of our audiences are not. I still think the fact she debuted as an opera actress at such a young age is a more interesting fact to a wide audience. It may probably be common knowledge for opera fans, but probably less so for the layman. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:27, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
I hear you but am unconvinced. Many artists start young, that's nothing personal. DYK is for things the readers don't yet know, including Werther. A headline in a review said "is a Charlotte to die for", - that is personal. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:52, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
Well I suppose if you don't want to talk about her debuting as a child, we probably should stick to the original hook. ALT1 just isn't very interesting, in my opinion. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:56, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Theresienstadt (1944 film)

5x expanded by Catrìona (talk). Self-nominated at 12:02, 17 October 2018 (UTC).

Edgemere Landfill

  • ... that the Edgemere Landfill in New York City was claimed to be "the longest continuously operating dump in the United States", accepting waste from 1938 to 1991? Source: NY Times 1991. "Opened in 1938, Edgemere was the longest continuously operating dump in the United States and perhaps the oldest, the Sanitation Department says."
    • ALT1:... that food waste at New York City's Edgemere Landfill was shredded and poisoned to prevent birds from interfering with operations from nearby JFK Airport? Source: NY Times 1975. "Intensifying their campaign to minimize the bird‐strike hazard at Kennedy International Airport, local authorities have applied for permission to conduct a limited food‐poisoning experiment at a nearby garbage dump. They also are erecting a grid of horizontal wires over the disposal area, which is located at Edgemere in the Rockaways."
    • ALT2:... that the Edgemere Landfill was created because New York City parks commissioner Robert Moses wanted to develop the landfill as parkland? Source: Rockaway Wave. "An extensive landscape waterfront park is planned eventually for the property now being filled by the Department of Sanitation in Edgemere on the Jamaica Bay shore. The site is between Norton and Somerfleld basins north of Almeda avenue and was originally a part of the former state lands under the jurisdiction of the Department of Marine and Aviation.""

Created by Tdorante10 (talk). Nominated by Epicgenius (talk) at 15:36, 14 October 2018 (UTC).


Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - Issues with all 3 hooks. The first hook cites a 1991 source which is too old for such a claim. The citation for ALT1 says that permission was applied for but not that it was granted and actioned. The citation for ALT2 doesn't mention Moses and his intentions.
  • Interesting: Red XN - All hooks have reasonable potential but would benefit from work to improve their impact.

Image eligibility:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg I am interested in the topic, having written the article dirt which highlighted some other landfills. A lot of work has gone into this page and the authors' efforts are appreciated, Andrew D. (talk) 12:18, 28 October 2018 (UTC)

@Andrew Davidson: Thanks for the review. For ALT0 and ALT1, how about this?
  • ALT0A: ... that when it closed in 1991, the Edgemere Landfill in New York City was claimed to be "the longest continuously operating dump in the United States", having accepted waste since 1938?
  • ALT1A: ... that officials proposed shredding and poisoning food waste at New York City's Edgemere Landfill to prevent birds from interfering with operations from nearby JFK Airport?
For ALT2, Moses is mentioned in a later source. I think it's this one, where Moses remarks, "... lies the new Edgemere Park, the newest and largest park on the Rockaway peninsula. [...] When this area is filled and covered with manufactured topsoil, this park will be done. Eventually there will be an 18-hole golf course and marina together with passive a n d active play areas to care for the recreational needs of all ages in the housing and surrounding neighborhoods." There are other hooks I wanted to put in the article, but I forgot about them. I will do that tomorrow.
As for quotes, all of them are cited. The "toxic landfill" quote, for example, is reference 6, two sentences up. I guess the source was placed at the end of the three sentences so it wouldn't be repeated. Other controversial quotes also have references, but they're just at the end of the sentences. I can fix them tomorrow (put the sources at the end of actual quotes) when I have access to an actual computer. I'd like to have an image in the hook. Maybe this might work? epicgenius (talk) 16:10, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Ok, no rush. Just ping me when it's ready for another look, please. Andrew D. (talk) 18:00, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Andrew Davidson: I've addressed the quote problem. How about the hooks above, or another hook: epicgenius (talk) 14:58, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
    • ALT3: ...that New York City's Edgemere Landfill was declared a Superfund environmental cleanup site after nearly three thousand 55-gallon metal drums of waste were discovered during a routine excavation? Source: NY Daily News, 1987
    • ALT4: ...that Edgemere Landfill has been proposed for conversion to parkland since the 1950s, though a permanent structure on the site cannot be developed until 2021? Sources: (1) Rockaway Wave, 1958, Moses speech. (2) Rockaway Wave, 2000. "The site is reportedly being monitored and it will be only 21 more years (July, 2021) before a permanent structure can be erected on the site or before it can really be used for the Rockaway public park that has been marked on maps of the area for decades."
Just my two cents, I like ALT3. Tdorante10 (talk) 17:29, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
@Epicgenius: I've been quite busy with other matters but will take another look now. More anon. Andrew D. (talk) 14:45, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

Gern Nagler

  • ... that Gern Nagler successfully petitioned NFL Commissioner Bert Bell to create the league's first player pension during his only season with the Pittsburgh Steelers? Source: "Nagler was involved with the early efforts to organize a players' union, and was a key figure in the creation of the first players' pension. Nagler and Cleveland Browns end Billy Howton presented NFL Commissioner Bert Bell with a draft anti-trust lawsuit, threatening to file if the NFL did not immediately establish a pension for its players. The gambit worked, and the pension was formally established three years later." (source: The Oregonian article)
    • ALT1:... that Chicago Cardinals end Gern Nagler helped coach the Fort Sill base football team to a perfect record and a Poinsettia Bowl victory in 1954? Source: "Nagler missed the 1954 NFL season due to military service. While posted at Fort Sill, Oklahoma, Nagler helped coach the base football team to the All-Service Championship, winning the 1954 Poinsettia Bowl (source: Lawton Constitution article)

5x expanded by Caknuck (talk). Self-nominated at 09:37, 14 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg The expansion on this article was well over 5x and was new enough at the time of nomination. The article is long enough at almost 2,200 characters, and the hooks are interesting and adequately formatted. I can't access that Oregonian page, but will AGF that it adequately supports part of the first hook fact. Unfortunately, the bit about him spending one season with Pittsburgh doesn't have an inline cite, which is required by the DYK rules. ALT1 is verified by the Lawton Constitution article. I do have a couple of other concerns here. First, the fifth paragraph doesn't have any references at all, which goes against DYK guidelines. DYK doesn't require GA-level sourcing, but at least one reference per paragraph is the minimum standards. This information should be available on his Pro Football Reference page, in addition to the length of his Pittsburgh career. Second, ref 3 (one of the only links I was able to spot-check) doesn't verify when Nagler was drafted; again, Pro Football Reference should have this listed on his profile there. The other source I spot-checked, ref 2, had no issues. Fix these couple of issues and this article should be ready. Giants2008 (Talk) 01:21, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
@Giants2008:  Done
  • Citations have been provided for the draft, his PFR profile (which indicates his one year in Pittsburgh) and his Pro Bowl selection.
  • The text of the Oregonian article is available on this blog, and I was able to confirm the text of the article via newsbank.com. (Newsbank is reliable, but requires an login account to use. I get access via my public library.)
Please let me know if you have any other concerns for me to address. Thanks, caknuck ° needs to be running more often 12:25, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
Symbol voting keep.svg The changes look good. This article is ready to go now. Giants2008 (Talk) 17:41, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svg @Caknuck: @Giants2008: @Edwardx: sorry for the inconvenience, this has been sent back to the nom page following issues raised by The Rambling Man, including an orange tag on the article indicating that it needs additional citations. Please have a look at these issues, and then the page can be resubmitted. Thanks  — Amakuru (talk) 22:59, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

@Amakuru: Since it was my approval that caused this, I went ahead and sourced/removed the uncited items. If the primary contributor wants to source and re-add the other items with references I don't have access to, I certainly wouldn't object. Giants2008 (Talk) 00:07, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 15

Rhythm Inside (Loïc Nottet song)

  • ... that in a music video for Belgian singer Loïc Nottet's "Rhythm Inside" (2015), a woman playing Alice is approached by "creepy" and "evil" nurses? https://wiwibloggs.com/2015/05/10/watch-loic-nottet-goes-topless-in-alice-in-nightmareland-video/93519/

Improved to Good Article status by Cartoon network freak (talk). Self-nominated at 14:37, 15 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg Starting review: is indeed GA status and nominated in time. Article is big enough and cited throughout. Correct person credited. Hook is 178 characters, and links to the article. However the reference supplied does not confirm the hook, as it fails to mention much of its detail. QPQ does not appear to be done and this is the 10th nomination for User:Cartoon network freak. Also no copyright problem found. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 01:55, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  • What you added is a primary source, so the hook can be considered sourced. But I am still awaiting a review of another did you know nomination. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 10:50, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

Enclave law

  • ... that as a result of Enclave law, Israeli civil law in the West Bank applies only to Israeli settlers? Source: John Ehrenberg; Yoav Peled (29 July 2016). Israel and Palestine: Alternative Perspectives on Statehood. Rowman & Littlefield Publishers. pp. 192–. ISBN 978-1-4422-4508-2.

Created by Onceinawhile (talk). Self-nominated at 09:32, 15 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Comment:This clearly not true as it applies to Palestinians as well for example minimum wage. --Shrike (talk) 10:08, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Your statement is incorrect. Per the source provided by Icewhiz below, "a 2008 high court ruling that Israeli labor laws apply to relations between Palestinian workers and Israeli employers in settlements in the West Bank and East Jerusalem". So Palestinians are not covered by these laws unless they are within the Israeli settlement enclaves. Onceinawhile (talk) 13:21, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
  • (ec) Hook issues - there are three issues with the hook. The first is that "Enclave law" is an informal term always or almost always scare-quoted in sources (including the source cited above) - there is no single "enclave law" - it is a very large amalgamation of legislation (that applies Israeli code, e.g. the income tax, on Israeli residents of the Area) and military orders (that extends Israeli legislation to areas under the military commander). Second - saying this "applies only to Israeli settlers" is incorrect - even per the simplistic source cited this also applies to Israeli settlements. For instance, Israeli labour law applies to Palestinian workers in settlements and industrial zones - e.g. And for the roughly 3,300 Palestinians who work in Barkan, the appeal is clear. They are treated equally in the workplace, earning the same salaries and benefits as their Israeli counterparts under Israeli law.NYT or Country Reports on Human Rights Practices for 2011. Third - not all Israeli civil law applies - but large portions - see this source, for examples see - this and this for examples of legislation that do not apply. Icewhiz (talk) 10:17, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
See amended version below, reflecting Icewhiz’s points. Onceinawhile (talk) 13:24, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
I would suggest -
The stmt of "only within Israeli settlements" is incorrect - e.g. Amira Hass who resides in Ramallah is liable for Israeli income tax (as well as other legislation (usually - obligations) applied to Israeli citizens in the area) as it applies to any income of an Israeli citizen in the Area (is also explicitly includes area A) - income tax code, clause 3A. Icewhiz (talk) 13:39, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
This is a good improvement, thanks. Two points:
(1) Under your revised formulation of both Israeli residents and settlements, the word “only” can now be correctly added back.
(2) I haven’t seen a source for the word “process” here, unless applied to the “pipelining” method discussed in the article. So we could say “through a process of pipelining of Enclave law...”
Onceinawhile (talk) 14:09, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Point 1 - I would avoid "only", as it may be imprecise in other regards (e.g. some possible aspects of roads in area C come to mind) and I don't think it would clear with such wording that portions of Israeli law applies to Palestinians when they are in israeli settlements/zones. As for point 2 - I am not married to "process" (which is also somewhat imprecise) - however I do take issue with "Enclave laws" or "Enclave law" as an entity - there is no such entity at present and hasn't been - what there is (and one of the sources used "pipelining" for only one aspect of this - the military ordinances) is a hodgepodge of Israeli legislation applying obligations to Israeli citizens/residents in the area as well as military ordinances ("pipelines") applying copies of the Israeli law to areas under the authority of the military commander. Rubenstein (who is the original for this quote) described the resulting situation as "enclave law". "enclave law" refers to the situation created by the amalgamation of legislation - but not to the legislation itself (e.g. see the example I linked to from the tax law [10] - at a random point in 1978 the Knesset applied this specific bill to Israeli residents/citizens in the Area by adding a very small clause to bill (they then fixed this in 1994 to clarify the situation due to Oslo, and also updated following unrelated tax changes (e.g. the move from territorial taxation to worldwide personal taxation in 2002). On the VAT bill - [11] - they added a similar clause - but at a different random point in 1986 (and again, updated in 1994 due to Oslo). We could perhaps refer to a resulted in a situation of "Enclave Law" ? Icewhiz (talk) 14:43, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Lest I be accused of OR above - per Israeli police traffic enforcement guide (page 3 in the PDF) - enforcement in Area C vs. Palestinian citizens is exactly the same as in Israel with the exception of changing the law/ordinance name (פקודת התעבורה turns into צו בדבר התעבורה (יהודה ושומרון) - and "תקנות התעבורה" turns into "תקנות התעבורה (יהודה ושומרון)" - however clause numbering is the same. Icewhiz (talk) 15:28, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
OK. Your “resulted in” formulation would require a restructuring of the sentence - do you have something in mind? Onceinawhile (talk) 17:32, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
How about -
ALT1 ... that Amnon Rubinstein coined the term "Enclave law" to describe the application of large portions of Israeli civil law to Israeli settlements in the Occupied Palestinian territories?
ALT2 ... that the term "Enclave law" has heen used to describe the application of large portions of Israeli civil law to Israelis and Israeli settlements in the West Bank?
The first follows the description in ACRI of what Rubenstein wrote in 87. The second is more contemporary.Icewhiz (talk) 18:53, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Either fine with me. It would be nice to end ALT1 with "in place of the word apartheid", using the two sources at the bottom of the article, but something tells me you might object to that!
A DYK reviewer is best placed to decide between the two options. Onceinawhile (talk) 20:20, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Tying in Jeff Halper's or Jonathan Cook's opinions onto Rubenstein would be a BLP issue vs. Rubenstein. Both are probably undue in the article regardless. But I'm happy we're at agreement regarding the hook.Icewhiz (talk) 21:17, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Symbol redirect vote 4.svg New reviewer requested. Onceinawhile (talk) 20:23, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svg Currently, there is an outstanding merge proposal and multiple cleanup tags in the article. Given the sensitivity of the topic, strongly recommend resolving them before asking for another review. Catrìona (talk) 20:32, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
@Catrìona: Hi Catriona, the clean up is now complete. The merge proposal did not gain consensus, and the tags have been resolved. Onceinawhile (talk) 08:42, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
General eligiblity:
  • New Enough: Green tickY
  • Long Enough: Red XN - Slightly over required 1500 characters readable prose, but I would consider this a stub. It just doesn't give much information.
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Striking rejected hooks. Strongly recommend against the word "apartheid" which is highly/unecessarily controversial, even in terms of an analogy. Should it be "Enclave law" or "enclave law"? Catrìona (talk) 09:46, 23 October 2018 (UTC)

Thank you Catrìona. I think lower case is better. Per readable prose, I will lengthen it from the sources. Onceinawhile (talk) 10:13, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
Please note the ongoing discussion at Talk:Enclave_law#Concept_vs_terminology_-_source_dispute. Onceinawhile (talk) 08:22, 2 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 16

Joseph Jagger

Joseph Jagger
Joseph Jagger

Created by Philafrenzy (talk) and Whispyhistory (talk) and Edwardx (talk). Nominated by Philafrenzy (talk) at 21:29, 20 October 2018 (UTC).


Policy compliance:

  • Adequate sourcing: Red XN - Fletcher's book seems to be the most thoroughly researched but is not used for the inline citations. The other sources seem weaker and so details like the year of the bank-breaking isn't clear. Fletcher has a family heirloom with an inscription which is dated 1884 and says that he took four years to do this. I reckon we should be using the best source more to clarify such issues.
  • Neutral: Green tickY
  • Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing: Green tickY

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Green tickY
  • Interesting: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Red XN - The hook shouldn't link to the song because it seems unlikely that Jagger was the inspiration for the song. A better link would be to men who broke the bank at Monte Carlo, which explains the concept (and which also needs updating to include Jagger). I'll set this up as ALT1 for clarity.
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg It's a good story and I'm tempted to get Fletcher's book myself to read more. Perhaps we can share a copy at the meetup? Has someone ordered it yet? Andrew D. (talk) 21:12, 28 October 2018 (UTC)

I don't have Fletcher's book, and haven't ordered it. The main source for the article is the piece in The Times which was clearly drawn from Fletcher's book, so I took that to be the most authoritative source for the year 1881 as I thought she and The Times must be right. There are multiple earlier sources that give slightly different years for the event, including Brewers, but I took them all to be less reliable than the recent biography. We could certainly get the book and someone should but that might have to wait until the article is expanded to GA. As The Times clearly drew their article from Fletcher's book, I feel the sourcing is reasonable at this stage. Philafrenzy (talk) 10:44, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

My apologies if I am not using this page correctly. I have just edited the Joseph Jagger page as I am the author of a newly published biography of him. I have changed some points that are factually wrong according to my research and I have cited my book as the source of key facts rather than The Times journalist who interviewed me. I hope that does not infringe marketing policies? I wanted the source to be as accurate as possible but don't want it to seem like self-promotion. And thank you for the very nice comments here about my book!I hope that the changes are acceptable Anne C Fletcher (talk) 18:45, 20 November 2018 (UTC)Anne Fletcher, author From the Mill to MOnte Carlo

Ismail Amat

  • ... that Ismail Amat was one of the highest-ranking Uyghur politicians of China? Source: Song 2014

5x expanded by Zanhe (talk). Self-nominated at 23:37, 19 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg Before making deeper reviews, the article is not five folded (it was 1862 characters before the expansion began and just 4556 characters after the last edit). Moreover, the article had appeared in the ITN in the recent death row. (pinging BlueMoonset to see if my rejection is right). --Mhhossein talk 13:19, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Mhhossein: You're mistaken. The pre-expansion version had 638 characters, not 1862, because templates, categories, etc. do not count, only prose characters do. And appearance in "recent deaths" does not disqualify an article for DYK, only bolded appearances do. Please read rule 1D: "Articles linked at ITN or OTD not in bold, including the recent deaths section, are still eligible." -Zanhe (talk) 19:21, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Zanhe, Mhhossein, this is a very odd one, because apparently DYKcheck is adding a huge number of prose characters due entirely to the "lang-ug" template. When that template is removed from the article (tested in Preview without changing the article), the total character count drops from 4556 characters to 3385 characters. When I do the same to the September 3, 2018 version of the article, which is the one prior to the expansion (Mhhossein, you should use the edit prior to the date the expansion started for the "before" count, regardless of who made the first edit on the expansion date), the total character count drops from 1843 to 657. This just makes it as a 5x expansion, because 5 x 657 is 3285, which is more than covered by the 3385 in the article. I'm not sure whether the language equivalents in those initial parenthesis should count as prose or not, but I don't think we should sweat it under the circumstances. I should add that Zanhe is correct, in that a non-bold appearance in recent deaths at ITN does not disqualify an article for DYK. BlueMoonset (talk) 21:24, 8 November 2018 (UTC) (updated at 05:52, 9 November 2018 (UTC) to add "more than covered" in clarifying my prior statement)
  • @Zanhe: As you see the main problem stems from the "lang-ug" template and hence I was not mistakenly counting templates, categories, etc. I knew that only readable prose had to be considered, that's what the DYK check tool do normally. Anyway, thanks to BlueMoonset's clarifying comment, I'll resume the review process. --Mhhossein talk 12:50, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg The article is long and properly expanded within the due time. I see no copyvio and no prose issues. The hook is just hooky, properly sourced and long enough. However, I'm suggesting another hook, with one word added to the suggested original hook, which is somehow more interesting in my view:
ALT1:... that Ismail Amat was one of the highest-ranking Uyghur politicians of China's history?
Let's see what Zanhe thinks about it. --Mhhossein talk 12:21, 14 November 2018 (UTC)


  • ... that Befehlsnotstand was a reliable defence in war crimes trials in Germany in the 1950s and 1960s but research into the subject since has proven that it did not exist? Source: Hatten SS-Mitglieder damals wirklich „keine Wahl“? SS-Einsatzgruppen: Warum junge Männer im Akkord morden (both in German)

Created/expanded by Turismond (talk). Self-nominated at 04:51, 18 October 2018 (UTC).

Symbol question.svg Needed article, on good sources, no copyvio obvious. Questions for the article:
  • Translation of the term - I see that Langenscheidt comes up with it, but think it's so misleading (as overly simple) that perhaps the source should not be used. You translate ref titles so well (mostly) that I think your translation might be more helpful than that one. You could first explain, and then give a translation.
  • How about moving the "Notstand" = necessity to Etymology. It holds up getting to the key fact.
  • "drastic consequences" - how about mentioning in the lead that this means danger to life or body, nothing less than that?
  • "reliable defense" - is that a legal term that I don't know, or a description that accused could rely on it to be pardoned? In other words: am I the only one who has a question about the meaning?
  • "Crisis created as a result of following orders" - I can't follow even if it's in a source. The crisis is imagined if NOT following orders, no?
  • "Under the circumstances of Befehlsnotstand, within German law, carrying out an unlawful order could not result in the prosecution of the culprit if disobeying would lead to drastic consequences for the person refusing to carry out the order." - Trying: "In German law, the situation Befehlsnotstand arises when a person refusing to carry out an unlawful order would have to face drastic consequences. In this situation, the person would not be prosecuted for carrying out the order."
  • "... that refusing an unlawful order did, in no known case, result in severe punishment" - I think the commas make the phrase wrong, because if we drop the clause we get to "... that refusing an unlawful order did result in severe punishment" which seems the opposite of what is meant. May be my lack of English, though.
  • "a state where the individual mistakenly believes their live is in danger"? - "a state where the individual mistakenly believes that their life is in danger" (if we have to use "their" for one person at all).
  • translate Mauerschürtzenprozesse?
  • Other countries, and then it's only one. How about getting the info about Austria from the German Wikipedia?
  • If it's Befehlsnotstand (I'm never sure about italics) we need {{italic title}}.
Regarding the hook, I am afraid it's completely uncomprehensible for someone who doesn't know already what it means. Can you put a bit more explanation in? - Tough topic, thank you for tackling it. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:23, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Gerda Arendt: Pretty amazing review! I will go through the individual points, fix them up at the next opportunity and let you know when I'm done. Thank you. Turismond (talk) 04:13, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
  • I have done a rewrite of the article along the line of your suggestions but, to be honest, my understanding of law subjects is to limited to truely achieve a satisfying result. Same goes for the hook, I'm struggling to come up with one that truely makes sense. I will give it some further thought and try to come up with a better hook. Turismond (talk) 14:02, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Gerda Arendt: I spend a fair bit of time researching and found the best translation of the term yet, Necessity to obey orders. What about the following hook? Its a difficult subject to explain, especially within hook-length requirements! Turismond (talk) 14:59, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
  • ALT1 ... that, after World War II, Befehlsnotstand, the necessity or compulsion to obey orders, was successfully used as defence in German war crimes trials, but has been proven to not have existed?
Thank you, just returned after a day out, will look tomorrow. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:36, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
No rush from my side, plenty of time! Turismond (talk) 12:35, 25 October 2018 (UTC)

Some unsoliticited alternate hook suggestions that sidestep the linguistic issue: Catrìona (talk) 22:44, 28 October 2018 (UTC)

  • ALT2: ... that German soldiers were not forced to commit atrocities during World War II?
  • ALT3: ... that, although German soldiers were not forced to commit atrocities during World War II, many successfully used it as a legal defence at war crimes trials?
Thank you, both, returning after a busy day. I think we deal with a legal term, and while a pipe might work, the negative "not" makes it harder to understand. ALT1 is a bit too wordy, and in ALT3, I suggest to get the legal defense upfront. Also, to my knowledge, it concerned not only soldiers. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:11, 28 October 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 17


Created by Scope creep (talk). Self-nominated at 03:41, 17 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg--
  • Plagiarisation and Close paraphrasing is very-evident.
  • semi-acoustic instrument, with the sound being generated in the traditional way by striking strings is copied in toto from the source.
  • Although having no sound board, it was much lighter is copied in toto from the source.
  • Original research
  • Usage of the words:-- micro-hammer, eighteen microphones et cetera.
  • Many lines are un-sourced. They are (probably) sourced in some of the references but as much as inline cites are not required, it's optimum to use them.
  • Prose form is quite poor.
  • The Construction section starts with:-- The was semi-acoustic instrument which is meaningless.
  • The Marketing section again starts with:-- Bechstein reportedly built 150 copies of which exist today which is meaningless.The same can be said about the last line:-- and was restored in 2007 at the technical Museum Vienna ready to play and is used for concert purposes.
  • The entire paragraph reads like a marketing brochure of the piano (viz The stop has been refined by the micro pounding...., This avoids the knocking noise...... et al).A lot trivial details ( that typically hit the string at a force of 5%....) are noted.
  • Additionally, the term neo-petrof is used out of nowhere and is not even wiki-linked/ explained at a foot-note.
  • I have no idea about the 4th source.
  • This can be improved, quite a lot.Use the press-reviews and exploit the many rigorous sources which mention it, without getting bogged down into trivialities.And above all, copy-edit whatever you have written till now. (I will try to invest my own efforts, if possible:-) )
  • On a note, I have not even bothered to find out about QPQ:-)WBGconverse 07:01, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
Thanks WBG. That was bit of a wake up call. I never realised it was so bad. Thanks. Is it possible to take each in turn,
  • I can get rid of the plagiarism by rewording.
  • Regarding mirco hammer, I took this from the image, No. 5, mikrohammer. I thought that would be self evident. I have explained mechanics.
  • The stop has been refined by the micro pounding, technical detail of the first electric piano.
  • 5% was what made it unique, and its mentioned in a few sources. Explained.
  • I have reordered it and tried to address the points raised. scope_creep (talk) 08:36, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
  • QPQ doesnt seem to apply, as this is my first DYK. scope_creep (talk) 13:44, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Winged Blades of Godric: @Scope creep: What is the status of this nomination? It has been one month since the nominator's last post. I glanced at the page and see just a block of text. Subheads are the first thing needed. You may wish to apply for copyediting help at WP:GOCE. Yoninah (talk) 20:05, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Yoninah I think this DYK can probably be closed. I submitted it far too early. I started the article very late at night when I was sleeping, and submitted it, when it still needed a lot of work. user:Winged Blades of Godric came in, reviewed the DYK and rewrote the article, which I thought was nice and really cool and I copy-edited later, and later still added sections as requested. I don't think DYK is for me, as I tend to take some time to create an article, usually months, e.g. Platt Report 1959. Thanks. Please close this. scope_creep (talk) 00:24, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Scope creep: actually, with your reorganization, the article looks in better shape now. I'd like to re-review it in a little while, as it seems Winged Blades of Godric has recused himself by rewriting the article. I have added him to the DYK co-credits. Yoninah (talk) 08:02, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
ok scope_creep (talk) 09:16, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • OK, I've gone over the article and added a few "citation needed" tags to information that needs to be sourced. I would also like you to suggest a new hook – something that will "hook" the reader's interest, not an explanatory sentence. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 16:55, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I will update the article tomorrow. Yip, any help with the hook is cool. scope_creep (talk) 21:37, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Yoninah that is the citations added to the article as requested. There from a journal article, that discusses the design of the piano.scope_creep (talk) 16:28, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 18

Masterpiece (Basshunter song)

Created by Eurohunter (talk). Self-nominated at 14:06, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg The article is new enough, long enough, neutrally written, and has lots of inline citations, which is all good. There also appear to be no identifiable copyright concerns. But this nomination needs to be formatted correctly in keeping with the guidelines. Specifically, as per WP:DYKHOOK, the hook should link to the article itself (in this case Masterpiece (Basshunter song)) and the article should be bolded. The grammar in the hook (as well as the article) should be fixed too. The hook seems to be accurate as per the source (CelebMix) but I am uncertain about whether it is a reliable source. And just in case Eurohunter has 5 or more DYK credits (doesn't seem like it from their talk page archives), they need to do a QPQ. IntoThinAir (talk) 03:57, 26 October 2018 (UTC)
    • @IntoThinAir: I fixed hook formatting and grammar but I'm not sure if it's fixed. As I understood there is problem in the article too. Do you mean only this sentence or something else? CelebMix has over 285,000 followers on Twitter (follows itself almost 100,000) and has a draft in Wikipedia and they oranize interviews with artists. Eurohunter (talk) 08:03, 26 October 2018 (UTC)
      • It looks like CelebMix (and specifically articles on the website written by Jonathan Currinn) is considered a reliable source, so that's not an issue. I am glad you improved the hook, but some more information is needed regarding the song, so I think the hook should say something like "...that the lyrics of the 2018 Basshunter song "Masterpiece" reference the 2009 video game League of Legends?". With regard to the grammar in the article, I have just edited it to deal with some (really most) of the issues I noticed when I was first writing this review (e.g. "revelated" is not a word). But I didn't check the "Reception" section for syntax/grammar/spelling issues, so you should try to do so and fix any errors you may notice. IntoThinAir (talk) 13:34, 26 October 2018 (UTC)
        • @IntoThinAir: Thanks. Unfortunatelly I would never realise I have done these mistakes and I can't improve it any soon in new cases like that. I adjusted a hook as you showed me. Eurohunter (talk) 13:52, 27 October 2018 (UTC)

Hakea pulvinifera

Hakea pulvinifera
Hakea pulvinifera
  • ... that Hakea pulvinifera was first described in 1962, believed extinct in 1971 and rediscovered in 1988....? Source
  • Reviewed: TBA

5x expanded by Allthingsnative (talk). Nominated by Casliber (talk) at 13:42, 23 October 2018 (UTC).

Symbol question.svg The article is long enough, and has been 5x expanded recently enough. The article is well written, there are no obvious copyvios, not sure if the author did QPQ though. The DYK fact is not cited on that line, though the subsequent citations in the Taxonomy and Naming section check out. —User:SonOfPatter (User talk:SonOfPatter)

Articles created/expanded on October 21

Sozusagen grundlos vergnügt

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 15:19, 28 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg The full review is to come, but what do you think about these alternative hook suggestions?
Personally I find the translated title a more interesting fact than the poem being published after her death. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 02:15, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
As you like it. - Sadly, I found no other translation. This one is from a blog, and I am not sure about copyright. I am sure that we don't capitalise when we only give a translation, so changed that. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:40, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol redirect vote 4.svg The article is new enough and long enough, and it is adequately sourced. It is neutral and free from close paraphrasing. As mentioned above, I don't really find the first hook interesting as it's very common for works to be published after the author's death. My issue with my own proposals is that the translation is cited to a Wordpress blog, and I don't know if the blog is run by a reliable source on the subject and/or is authorized to host the poem. However, I don't really see much else hook-worthy in the article so it could be our best option here. As I proposed ALT1 and ALT1a, a new reviewer is need to choose a hook here. QPQ is still pending, so this can't be approved until one is provided. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:55, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
No new reviewer is needed, as no new facts were added, just reworded. I am sure we can say without citation problem that it can be translated that way. I would probably have stayed closer to the Herman and said "So-to-speak causelessly merry", but that's very minor. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:33, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Ruth Bettina Birn

  • ... that Ruth Bettina Birn, who coauthored a book with a male scholar in 1998, did not have a Wikipedia article until 2018, while the latter has had a page since 2003? Source: Wikipedia page history for Norman Finkelstein

Created by K.e.coffman (talk). Self-nominated at 22:20, 28 October 2018 (UTC).

Well, it's a bit "inside baseball" type of a hook, but when I saw the page A Nation on Trial, I was struck that Norman Finkelstein was linked and had an article, while Birn was not even red-linked: diff. They are equal co-authors of the book. The fact is supported by the article having been created in 2018, while Finkelstein's article history shows that it was created in 2003: [12]. I think it speaks to Wikipedia's "gender gap"; that's why I picked the hook. K.e.coffman (talk) 02:34, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
I understand the sentiment behind the hook, but unfortunately, rules are rules. A new hook may need to be suggested if it can't work out. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:14, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
  • ALT1 ...that Canadian Department of Justice has a position of chief historian? Source: Hiio, Toomas. "Toomas Hiio: Saksa salapolitsei Eestis ja eestlased Saksa salapolitseis". Sirvilauad.ee.
@Narutolovehinata5: I provided another option. K.e.coffman (talk) 00:56, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
I suppose that works, but I'm not sure why the source is an Estonian one. With that said, ALT1 can probably be tweaked further since: 1. the hook implies that it's about the position of chief historian rather than Birn, and because Birn is no longer in the said position. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:33, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
The Estonian source was the one which listed the length of Birn's tenure. But if it's not needed, I provided an English-lang source as the second link ("Profile"). K.e.coffman (talk) 01:41, 3 November 2018 (UTC)
Adding ping @Narutolovehinata5:. K.e.coffman (talk) 05:16, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
Yeah, I suppose that works. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:19, 5 November 2018 (UTC)

Social entrepreneurship in South Asia

Created by Wickersong (talk). Self-nominated at 23:02, 21 October 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - no
  • Interesting: Red XN - not really

QPQ: Red XN - not needed, users first DYK
Overall: Symbol delete vote.svg Beeblebrox (talk) 21:42, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svg I’m concerned with the overall quality of the writing. There are several passages containing broken, unclear, or confusing language, and I have to agree with the tag regarding undue weight. This is certainly a valid topic for an article, but this article seems a bit narrow and focuses only on a few specific organizations. This does not necessarily disqualify from from DYK, but it isn’t optimal to have such an article featured on the main page. Also, please provide a source which directly verifies the hook. Beeblebrox (talk) 22:27, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

Hi Beeblebrox, I'm currently working on this for an educational assignment and so am in the midst of heavily revising this article. I will work to address the issues with writing quality as well as undue weight as I expand on this article and improve upon it. Hopefully then it can be optimal. I also fixed the hooks up a bit more to hopefully make it more interesting and added citations. How quickly do I need to revise this article to still have it up for consideration? Wickersong (talk) 23:15, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

Once you’re “in the system” so to speak I think you’re good as far as timing, there isn’t really a deadline. Beeblebrox (talk) 04:22, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Beeblebrox: The nominator hasn't edited in over a week; have your concerns been addressed? If not, and/or the nominator doesn't return soon, I will mark this for closure. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:53, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
The hook and alt are now cited, so that’s half of it, but the article itself hasn’t been improved. I’m afraid they took my comment about timing a bit too literally, obviously it is expected that the issues will be fixed at some point but it looks as though they’ve walked away for now. Beeblebrox (talk) 20:51, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
Hi all I am working on it today and over the next few days/this week to improve the article itself. I've been unable to work on it because of school. Happy to get any more feedback @Beeblebrox: and @Narutolovehinata5: as I revise. Will let you both know once I've reached a good point with this article. Wickersong (talk) 15:49, 3 November 2018 (UTC)
@Beeblebrox: and @Narutolovehinata5: I've revised the article quite a bit. Please review and let me know whether there's anything else I should fix in order to perfect my nomination for DYK Wickersong (talk) 16:04, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 22

Ma'adin Ijafen

Source: Red Gold of Africa: linked page covers date, name of explorer and site, number of brass ingots, and location. The ‘Lost Caravan’ of Ma’den Ijafen Revisited: covers the cowrie shells. Indigenous African Metallurgy: Nature and Culture: page 323 covers the dating.

Source: Red Gold of Africa: linked page covers date, name of explorer and site, and location. The ‘Lost Caravan’ of Ma’den Ijafen Revisited: covers the cowrie shells. Indigenous African Metallurgy: Nature and Culture: page 323 covers the dating and total weight of hoard.

5x expanded by Premeditated Chaos (talk). Self-nominated at 03:04, 26 October 2018 (UTC).

Paul Tuttle

  • ... that Paul Tuttle is known for designing the "Z" chair, also known as the "Rocket Launcher"? “California Design: The Legacy of West Coast Craft and Style.”
    • ALT1:... that Paul Tuttle won the first ever Carson Pirie Scott Young Designer Award for the popular "Z" Chair in 1966? “California Design: The Legacy of West Coast Craft and Style.”

Created by SonOfPatter (talk). Self-nominated at 07:57, 22 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg Do you have a citation that you can add to this statement? - "Tuttle continued this work until his death in 2002." SL93 (talk) 23:27, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  • It would be great to have a citation after this statement - "Grether hired Tuttle as a design consultant, eventually connecting him to the Swiss furniture company Strassle International." It might be in the following reference in the next paragraph, but I can't tell since the book is offline. SL93 (talk) 23:31, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 23

Li Lianda

  • ... that pharmacologist Li Lianda claimed that a pharmaceutical company's product was unsafe, but lost a lawsuit brought by the company? Source: Sina Finance

Created by Zanhe (talk). Self-nominated at 05:28, 28 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg @Zanhe: Honestly I don't find the proposed hook interesting: it's very common for people to employees to claim that their employer's product or service is unsafe, and lose lawsuits. In fact, it's also common for people to lose lawsuits on claims about company safety. We may need a new hook here. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:50, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Jennifer Foerster

  • ... that Jennifer Foerster is involved in philanthropic leadership by co-directing For Girls Becoming, a program fostering arts education in women and girls of the Muscogee Nation?

Created by Jamieowens (talk). Nominated by Jamieowens (talk) at 15:31, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg Nomination fails Eligibility citeria rule no 3 and 4, that is, the hook is uncited and the article has multiple problems. L293D ( • ) 15:35, 25 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg As this is the nominator's first nomination, I think some leeway could be given here. Like instead of marking for closure, we could give the nominator some more time (maybe a week or two) to fix the article issues (right now, the article is below the 1,500 character requirement). With that said, they haven't edited since the 24th, so it still has to be seen if the issues can be addressed promptly. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 12:54, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
  • I have fixed a couple of the issues. The article is now up to 1811 characters and is not an orphan. I have cited a couple of books where she is mentioned.Mary Mark Ockerbloom (talk) 04:23, 3 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg It appears that Mary has been able to address some, if not all of the remaining issues (I've taken the liberty of adding her as a co-nom for this). The nominator still hasn't edited since October 23, and the article now has a big "notability" tag at the top. A third opinion is needed to see if the said tag applies, but for disclosure I feel that it does not. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:25, 11 November 2018 (UTC)

A Scary Time (for Boys)

  • ALT2:... that a viral protest song encourages Americans to vote in today's election because "it sure is a scary time for boys"?
  • Reviewed: Raúl Meza Ontiveros
  • Comments: Requesting 6 November as a special occasion date; the song references the US election but does not endorse any candidate.

Created by Catrìona (talk). Self-nominated at 19:04, 23 October 2018 (UTC).

ALT0 and ALT1 are too passive in my opinion; I really, really like ALT2. A couple more alts below. wumbolo ^^^ 09:04, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 24

Dr. Horatio Q. Birdbath

  • ... that Dr. Horatio Q. Birdbath, a voice actor skilled in mimicking the sounds of animals and birds, was the voice of Cheetah in the Tarzan movies? Source: 2005)
    • ALT1: ... that Dr. Horatio Q. Birdbath was a voice actor skilled in mimicking the sounds of animals and birds? Source: 2005)

Created/expanded by Zacharyfruhling (talk). Nominated by The lorax (talk) at 15:45, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg I came by to review this, but did a lot of copyediting and wikifying on this article to bring it up to Wikipedia standards. However, the article does not feel like it meets DYK's start-class Rule D7 yet; it's more like a list of his roles with no real description or indication of notability. You can't assume that readers know the importance of the films he appeared in; you have to tell them (sourced, of course).
  • I moved the page to Purv Pullen, the name he was born with and known by for many years before becoming Dr. Birdbath. If you can add more about his personal life, such as who he married and where he lived and died, it would be helpful. FYI the IMDB and Find a Grave are not considered reliable sources; I removed them from the text and put them under External Links.
  • The bit about the Q. in his stage name needs a reliable source. The whole Filmography section needs to be sourced to reliable sources, like encyclopedia articles or online or print articles. It might also be a good idea to break it into film and television roles. No QPQ needed for nominator with less than 5 DYK credits. Yoninah (talk) 22:58, 27 October 2018 (UTC)

Dui Bigha Jomi

Rabindranath Tagore
Rabindranath Tagore
  • Reviewed: Doing...

Created by Titodutta (talk). Self-nominated at 07:17, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg, new, copyvio ok, could be expanded and improved further. Once QPQ done, ok for dyk, picture okay. Hook is in article and sourced. Whispyhistory (talk) 22:08, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

Vincent Toro

Created by Audreyspell (talk). Self-nominated at 19:47, 24 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg The subject appears to be notable as the winner of an important poetry award, the Norma Farber First Book Award. (The Sawtooth Poetry Prize is not notable and should not be mentioned in the hook.) However, the sourcing in the article is mostly based on user-generated content (pw.org and kwelijournal.org) and there is no detail on his personal life or his notability, aside from what the page creator is writing in a promotional tone. At this time, the article does not meet Rule D7 IMO. The hook is also not the most interesting ("Did you know that X won the Y award?"). Image is freely licensed. No QPQ needed for nominator with less than 5 DYK credits. Yoninah (talk) 21:11, 11 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 25

People's Redemption Council

Created/expanded by Danielnicastro (talk). Nominated by Danielnicastro (talk) at 05:28, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

Ahmadou Ahidjo

  • ... that Ahmadou Ahidjo was the first president of Cameroon following its independence?

5x expanded by Victoria0998 (talk). Self-nominated at 17:26, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

  • Adequate sourcing: Red XN - No. A few lines which are unsourced need to be addressed. Ex. "Few images remain of President Ahmadou Ahidjo, and it is often said[by whom?] that the Biya regime made an active effort to erase any visual or audio references to Cameroon's first head of state."
  • Neutral: Green tickY
  • Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing: Red XN - No. According to Copy Vio tool, two violations are found. One is a mirror site. The other is a blog. I am not sure if this is a case where content was copied from Wikipedia to the blog, or it was the other way around. The content on Wikipedia is sourced to an offline book which seems reliable enough though. Please clarify and see if any other sources are available for the same content.

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Green tickY
  • Interesting: Red XN - Not really
  • Other problems: Red XN - Please use correct hook format. Link articles and bold main article Ahmadou Ahidjo. See other hooks for format to get a better idea.

QPQ: Red XN - Not applicable according to QPQ Check. Less than 5 DYKs.
Overall: Symbol possible vote.svg Copy violations need to be addressed. Please check using the Earwig's Copyvio Detector. Also, format hook correctly and add source. Expansion 5X, but performed on 24th, nominated for 25th. Please confirm. [Note: This is my first review. You can get a second opinion.] DiplomatTesterMan (talk) 06:57, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

1994 Gambian coup d'état

5x expanded by Ira.morga3 (talk). Self-nominated at 03:32, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg @Ira.morga3: The article was nominated the day 5x expansion happened, so it meets the date criterion. I wasn't able to find any close paraphrasing. This is the nominator's first nomination so a QPQ is not required. Although I suppose both hooks are potentially interesting, I have concerns with both: for the first, I'm not sure if bloodless coups are really unusual as I'm aware it's happened before in other places. The second hook might be too obtuse for people unfamiliar with political science: it would be advisable to add a link to Waves of democracy in the said hook. Otherwise, both are cited inline: ALT0 reference is verified, while I can't access ALT1's source so for now it is accepted AGF. The article is of an appropriate length, but I would suggest that the "The Paradox to the Third Wave of Democratization" section be rewritten in a more neutral tone. As for the "The Paradox to the Third Wave of Democratization" claim itself, I would suggest that some background be written about it (i.e. who formulated that term, and in what context) as the term is discussed rather abruptly. I would also suggest that the "Coup" and "Discontent in the Gambia" sections be switched (i.e. "Discontent in the Gambia" comes before "Coup", to give background). This will be good to go once these issues have been addressed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:45, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 26


Karuka nut cluster
Karuka nut cluster
  • ... that during karuka harvest, entire households will move upland and start speaking a Pandanus language? Source: Franklin, Karl J. (September 1972). "A Ritual Pandanus Language of New Guinea". Oceania. 43 (1): 66–76.
    • ALT1:... that in the New Guinea Highlands, entire households including pigs will move to harvest karuka nuts? Source: Rose, C. J. (1982). Bourke, Richard Michael; Kesavan, V., eds. "Preliminary Observations on the Pandanus nut (Pandanus jiulianettii Martelli)". Proceedings of the Second Papua New Guinea Food Crops Conference. 1: 160–167.

Created by NessieVL (talk). Self-nominated at 23:54, 4 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on October 27

Gert Westphal

Katia and Thomas Mann
Katia and Thomas Mann
  • ... that when Gert Westphal recited works by Thomas Mann, his widow Katia (pictured with her husband) called him "des Dichters oberster Mund" (the poets principal voice)? Source: several
  • Reviewed: to come

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 22:13, 4 November 2018 (UTC).

Worked on it, dropped a few that to know seems less relevant in English. I have a problem with Schallplattenkritik, because they have only an archive to search, and I am too stupid to find more than two. (it seems to go by year, but when I insert 2005, I get again to 2002, for example.) I am sure though the others are as correct. Help? I found referencing for some of our awards articles rather sad, I must say. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:27, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 28

Rosalinda González Valencia

Source: "En 1996 Rosalinda González Valencia se casó con el que se convertiría en el hombre fuerte del Cártel Jalisco Nueva Generación, Nemesio Oseguera Cervantes / [English]: "In 1996 Rosalinda González Valencia married the one who would become the strong man of the Jalisco Cartel Nueva Generación, Nemesio Oseguera Cervantes." (El Universal) [English] "Known as “El Mencho,” Oseguera has risen to become Mexico’s most-wanted drug lord after Joaquin “El Chapo” Guzman was extradited to the United States last year to face trial." (Reuters)

Moved to mainspace by MX (talk). Self-nominated at 21:32, 29 October 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on October 30

Adrien Agreste

  • Comment: 4 DYK credits at the moment.

Converted from a redirect by Flowerpiep (talk). Self-nominated at 14:45, 1 November 2018 (UTC).

Max Rose (politician)

  • Comment: Strongly prefer the article to go on the main page before November 6, when the election occurs

Converted from a redirect by Philepitta (talk) and La comadreja (talk). Nominated by La comadreja (talk) at 20:44, 30 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Comment: This also reeks of advertising quite a bit. Really recommend findig an alternative hook. Juxlos (talk) 09:48, 1 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg Putting on hold until either after the deletion review ends, or after the election (whichever comes first). Note that the article is currently a redirect pending the DR outcome. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:16, 1 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg As the subject has won his election bid and the article has been restored, this is ready for a new review. Courtesy ping Serial Number 54129 and Juxlos. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 13:58, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Thank you Narutolovehinata5. It should probably fail again as the hook is clearly incorrect. We are at least lucky that the DRV kept it off the front page before the election, thus denying the oxygen of publicity so desperately wanted, it would seem, in the nom. ——SerialNumber54129 14:19, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol possible vote.svg @Serial Number 54129: Looking at the article now, I don't really see much wrong with it: it does appear to be adequately sourced and neutrally written (at least right now). My main issue is the hook proposals itself: as mentioned here, they appear to have a promotional, even campaigning, tone. My suggestion is that a variation of ALT0, perhaps focusing on his military career instead of his campaign, would option here. @Philepitta and La comadreja: In the interest of disclosure, hooks are prohibited from being run 30 days before a subject's election date unless all major candidates are featured as well; as such, the request to be featured before November 6 would have been disallowed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 10:01, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
Indeed, my issue was only ever with the spammy hook, not the article. Agree with you that the issue could be resolved with a hook that focusses on something other than his political career. ——SerialNumber54129 10:23, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
@Serial Number 54129: I think the best option here is ALT0 since it's more about his military career and the part about being a candidate is only a descriptor. Do you have any ideas on how to reword it? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:11, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
Max Rose won the election. I would reword it as: ... that Max Rose, U.S. Representative of Staten Island and South Brooklyn, is a veteran of the Afghanistan conflict and served as chief of staff at a health care nonprofit which runs clinics around New York City?
Thing is, he doesn't actually becomes Representative until January, so that might need to be reworded depending on when this will be promoted. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 02:56, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
So maybe we could call him "representative-elect"?

Articles created/expanded on October 31

Fatih (drillship)

Source: "İlk sondaj gemimiz Deepsea Metro-2 Türkiye'de" (in Turkish) [18], "Name of the ship: FATIH, Former names: DEEPSEA METRO II (2018, Marshall Islands)" [19]

Created by CeeGee (talk). Self-nominated at 12:53, 7 November 2018 (UTC).

Tracy LaQuey Parker

Moved to mainspace by MrLinkinPark333 (talk). Self-nominated at 20:19, 4 November 2018 (UTC).

Mirza Zulqarnain

Created by Philafrenzy (talk) and Whispyhistory (talk). Nominated by Philafrenzy (talk) at 08:46, 3 November 2018 (UTC).

Your Call Football

  • ... that the Interactive game Your Call Football allows participants to call real time plays in games that feature some former NFL and CFL players? Source: Story, Mark. ""Think you know more than the coaches? In new pro football league, fans will call the plays"". Lexington Herald-Leader. Lexington Herald-Leader. Retrieved 31 October 2018. Reisman,, Laurence. ""Charge your phone, 'real-life Madden' app to kick off giving fans chances to win". USA Today. USA Today. Retrieved 31 October 2018.
    • ALT1:... that participants can call real-time plays in the interactive game Your Call Football, which features some former NFL and CFL players? Source: Story, Mark. ""Think you know more than the coaches? In new pro football league, fans will call the plays"". Lexington Herald-Leader. Lexington Herald-Leader. Retrieved 31 October 2018. Reisman,, Laurence. ""Charge your phone, 'real-life Madden' app to kick off giving fans chances to win". USA Today. USA Today. Retrieved 31 October 2018.

Created/expanded by User:Rickwilson826 . Nominated by JC7V7DC5768 (talk). at 17:45, 31 October 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 1

New Mexico State Road 162

Created by Bacardi379 (talk) and Bill-on-the-Hill (talk). Nominated by Bill-on-the-Hill (talk) at 03:06, 8 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg The article is below the 1,500 characters of prose required and makes no mention of a shootout. I see from the article history that it used to be long enough and mentioned a shootout, but an editor removed it as a WP:COATRACK. Looking at it, I don't disagree. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:23, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
@Bacardi379: Last call to address the nomination issues raised above. If this cannot be resolved promptly, this nomination will be closed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 12:01, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

@Narutolovehinata5:,@Muboshgu: do you think that the info about the courthouse should be readded? That way id agree it should become a dyk. Bacardi379 (talk) 13:31, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Kenichi Hirose

Created by Kuon.Haku (talk). Self-nominated at 12:29, 1 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg A new hook might be needed here, as I don't really find the proposed hook to be interesting. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:09, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I agree; even past the grammar issues, the hook is not very interesting (it is a prestigious school but that is not clear to most readers). The article is barely at DYK size, and there is an AfD pending (though it looks like there are two keep !votes at this time). I think there might be a better hook here: Raymie (tc) 05:48, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
ALT1: ... that Kenichi Hirose went to Russia to test out assault rifles produced by Aum Shinrikyo founder Shoko Asahara?

Articles created/expanded on November 2

Hans-Joachim Schulze

  • Reviewed: to come
  • Comment: best on his birthday, 3 December

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 21:56, 9 November 2018 (UTC).

Economic history of the Philippines under Ferdinand Marcos

Former Philippine President Ferdinand Marcos
Former Philippine President Ferdinand Marcos
  • ... that the Philippine economy under Ferdinand Marcos faced its first major economic crisis because of heavy government borrowing in the lead-up to Marcos' 1969 re-election campaign? Marcos assumed the presidency only in 1965, when things started to spiral downward in the late 1960s as existing policies no longer encouraged rapid growth. The would-be dictator then pursued an aggressive, expensive run for a second term by foraying into the public treasury to boost his campaign, buy votes and threaten voters. The peso crashed in late 1969, and by the dawn of the following year it lost half its value, Conrado de Quiros wrote in "Dead Aim." ....The 1960s crisis, for economists Arsenio Balisacan and Hall Hill, "was triggered by one politician's particularly shameless efforts to maintain a grasp on the reins of the political machinery. - Diola, Camille. "Debt, deprivation and spoils of dictatorship
    • ALT1:... that the Philippine economy under Ferdinand Marcos saw GDP go from nearly 9% growth in 1976, to a recession where the economy contracted by 7.3% for two years, 1984 and 1985? Source:Gross domestic product (GDP) growth peaked right after Marcos’s declaration of Martial law in 1972, reaching nearly 9 percent in 1973 and 1976, partly driven by a commodity boom when the prices of major Philippine commodity exports like coconut and sugar went up. However, it was also under Marcos when the country hit the worst recession in history: a 7.3-percent contraction for 2 successive years in 1984 and 1985, as his grip on power waned. - Guido, Edson Joseph; de los Reyes, Che (2017), "The best of times? Data debunk Marcos's economic 'golden years'", ABSCBN News and Public Affairs
    • ALT2:...that the nosedive of the Philippine economy under Ferdinand Marcos in 1983 traces its roots to debt-driven growth, mostly during Marcos' second term, and during the earliest years of martial law? Source: "This strategy of borrowing heavily was “peculiar to the Marcos period” and carried great risk, De Dios said. It “produced historically impressive growth,” but also “created the conditions for the big collapse later,” he added....The turning point came when the US entered a recession in the third quarter of 1981 and increased interest rates, bloating the cost of Philippine borrowings. Debt servicing then became very difficult for Manila, as with other debt-dependent countries in Latin America. The economy began to decline in 1981, proving debt-driven growth was unsustainable. The country’s exports at the time failed to keep pace with the ballooning debt. - Guido, Edson Joseph; de los Reyes, Che (2017), "The best of times? Data debunk Marcos's economic 'golden years'", ABSCBN News and Public Affairs

Created by Alternativity (talk). Self-nominated at 08:55, 7 November 2018 (UTC).

AJ Gil

  • ... that AJ Gil, who placed eighth on the first season of American Idol, starred alongside Joe Jackson in the 2005 independent film Destination Fame? Source: Theodore, Jeff (November 2, 2005). "HOLLYWOOD ENTRANCE - 'Fame' given the red carpet treatment". The Jersey Journal. "After last week's red carpet reception for 'Destination Fame,' it might be time to change Bayonne's nickname from 'Peninsula City' to 'Hollywood East'...The night's most recognizable celebrity, hands down, was Joseph Jackson - father of superstar icons Michael and Janet Jackson. Jackson, making his big screen debut, plays a music promoter...A.J. Gil, a singer who finished in eighth place on the first season of the popular "American Idol" show, assumes the movie's lead role as Chris, a teen forced to grow up fast while mulling over gut-wrenching decisions."
    • ALT1:... that AJ Gil, who placed eighth on the first season of American Idol, sang the National Anthem during the first concert ever held at Seattle's Seahawks Stadium? Source: Taha Ebrahimi (August 20, 2002). BFD: Big names in pop, hip-hop pump up stadium crowd. The Seattle Times. "A cloudy and cold day at the Seahawks Stadium had the audience of yesterday's "Big Freakin' Deal" concert wondering whether they might be warmer in Seattle's new mass-transit system...Earlier in the day, A.J. Gil of TV's 'American Idol' got the day off by singing a high-noted national anthem...Hanging out backstage, A.J. Gil summed it up: 'I really like the new stadium. It has great acoustics.' The debut concert was a smash, but for the sake of future events, let's hope it never rains in Seattle."

Converted from a redirect by Jpcase (talk). Self-nominated at 17:16, 3 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 3

Ana Padurariu

  • ... that 16-year-old Ana Padurariu won silver on beam at her first senior world championships to bring Canada its fourth-ever world championship medal in women's artistic gymnastics?
    • ALT1:... that 16-year-old artistic gymnast Ana Padurariu won silver on beam at her first senior world championships to become the second-ever Canadian world medalist on the apparatus?
  • Reviewed: Coming soon.
  • Comment: The hooks are open for improvement.

Created/expanded by Moscow Connection (talk). Self-nominated at 06:30, 10 November 2018 (UTC).

Ojos de Mar

One pond with Aracar volcano in the background
One pond with Aracar volcano in the background
  • ... that salty, turquoise lakes (pictured) contain organisms that helped create the oxygen in Earth's atmosphere, and are of interest to industry due to their products?
  • Reviewed: Sara Cox (rugby union referee)
  • Comment: Attempted to make an interesting hook, if someone has a more interesting proposal that would be nice.

Created by Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk). Self-nominated at 13:55, 3 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 4


  • Reviewed: Throne Hall of Dongola
  • Comment: I know; I'm a few days late here! This was something I was planning on nominating a long time ago, but between everything I've been doing, I completely forgot about this until now. This is an extremely interesting topic and it would be really great to be able to get this on the main page. However, 5x expanding it would be impossible, due to how little encyclopedic information there is available, and it would be extremely difficult to get this to GA, so this would pretty much be the only way to get this to DYK. Is there any way a reviewer would consider ignoring all rules here? Thanks, and sorry for the delay!

5x expanded by SkyGazer 512 (talk). Self-nominated at 14:38, 14 November 2018 (UTC).

French submarine Armide

Armide, date unknown
Armide, date unknown
  • ... that when the sale of the French-built No14 (pictured) was cancelled by France during World War I, the Japanese Navy built another No14 by itself? Source: http://www.navypedia.org/ships/japan/jap_ss_schneider_laubeuf.htm
    • ALT1:... that when the submarine No14 (pictured), ordered by Japan, was seized by France before its sale, the Japanese Navy built its own No14 by itself? Source: http://www.navypedia.org/ships/japan/jap_ss_schneider_laubeuf.htm
    • ALT2:... that when the Japanese submarine No14 (pictured) was seized by France and commissioned into its navy as Armide, the Japanese Navy built its own No14 by itself? Source: http://www.navypedia.org/ships/japan/jap_ss_schneider_laubeuf.htm
  • Reviewed: Woodvale Park
  • Comment: feel free to remove "by itself" if you think it does not fit in well.

Created by L293D (talk). Self-nominated at 14:37, 12 November 2018 (UTC).

Oranges & Lemons (album)

  • ... that XTC's 1989 album Oranges & Lemons reimagines 1960s psychedelic music with modern instrumentation and technology? Source: "Partridge's ethos for this album appears to be a continuation of the Dukes Of Stratosphear aesthetic -- exploring the sound and colors of their '60s influences -- but he makes the unfortunate step of trying to filter it through modern instrumentation and technology." (link)
  • Comment: save for February 27, 2019 (the date of the album's 50th anniversary)

5x expanded by Ilovetopaint (talk). Self-nominated at 20:24, 10 November 2018 (UTC).

2018 Tallahassee shooting

Created by Jim Michael (talk) and Leaky.Solar (talk). Nominated by Morgan Ginsberg (talk) at 16:11, 5 November 2018 (UTC).

Raising hands

  • ... that raising hands is a gesture common to slaves, statues and students? Source: "when slaves accompanied their masters to public events, they were required to hold their hand up if they needed to be excused" [26]Source: "The Solid Rock Church, a Christian megachurch, had a 19-metre tall statue named ‘King of Kings’, which depicted Jesus with his arms raised in the air." [27]Source: "One study on hand-raising illustrated that students almost always looked directly at the teacher when raising their hands, and only looked away just before lowering their hand." [28]
    • ALT1:... that ...? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

Created/expanded by Giselle136. Nominated by Fransplace at 02:27, 16 November 2018 (UTC).

  • NB: note to reviewer - it'd be nice if the seven-day rule could be relaxed as this was part of an educational program :) Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 05:11, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 5

Laguna Socompa

  • ... that lifeforms that dominated Earth between 3.5 and 1.5 billion years ago still exist at Laguna Socompa in Argentina, their highest present-day occurrence?

Moved to mainspace by Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk). Self-nominated at 21:04, 5 November 2018 (UTC).

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol confirmed.svg You haven't provided a citation here, but the hook is cited in the article in the Stromatoliths section. --SkyGazer 512 Oh no, what did I do this time? 14:51, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Per WT:DYK discussion I am reopening this as it needs a new hook and perhaps a closer review:

ALT1: ... that biological structures growing in Laguna Socompa today were the dominant expression of life between 3.5 and 1.5 billion years ago? JoJo Eumerus mobile (talk) 16:30, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

The reviewer might want to consider adding something about the elevation or specify that they are aldo found elsewhere. JoJo Eumerus mobile (talk) 16:33, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Holcaspis brevicula

Holcaspis brevicula
Holcaspis brevicula
  • ... that only 10 specimens of the Eyrewell ground beetle (Holcaspis brevicula) have ever been found? Source: "Only 10 Eyrewell ground beetles have ever been found." Hancock, Farah (2018) "Dairy conversion threatens rare beetle habitat"
    • ALT1:... that the Eyrewell ground beetle (Holcaspis brevicula) occurs in just one pine plantation, currently being cut down and turned into dairy farms? Source: "The home of a threatened beetle is being replaced with 14,000 cows as part of a dairy conversion." Hancock, Farah (2018) "Dairy conversion threatens rare beetle habitat"
  • Reviewed: No QPQ needed, as this is my fifth DYK nomination (and last freebie)

Created by Giantflightlessbirds (talk). Self-nominated at 00:18, 12 November 2018 (UTC).

Charlie McGeever

Created by Leitirlad (talk). Self-nominated at 10:34, 8 November 2018 (UTC).


  • ... that the over-the-air subscription service for MVS TV in Mexico City only has three subscribers? Source: "Que conforme a la revisión hecha por el IFETEL a cargo de Gabriel Contreras, MVS sólo tiene 3 clientes en su servicio de televisión restringida Canal 52."

5x expanded by Raymie (talk). Self-nominated at 05:44, 7 November 2018 (UTC).

  • @Narutolovehinata5: I've added some additional material that should help. I don't think it's necessary to have a citation in *every* sentence per guideline, but the first main paragraph did not have any, which is no longer the case. Raymie (tc) 06:05, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

Qerim Sadiku

Created by 1l2l3k (talk), Gerda Arendt (talk), and Hatake (talk). Self-nominated at 13:57, 5 November 2018 (UTC).

ALT2: ... that Qerim Sadiku, born in today's Albania to a Muslim family, became a Catholic martyr and saint? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:30, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
@Gerda Arendt: I had that first, but then removed it, as I realized that the source doesn't say exactly that. Also I'm not finding a strong source that his family was Muslim. Do you have it? 1l2l3k (talk) 22:44, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 6

Vision of Lear

  • Reviewed: to come

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 21:31, 13 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg @Gerda Arendt: Article is just long enough. Would be great if it could be expanded a little. Hook is interesting and sourced to RS, as is the entire article. Nominated in time, no neutrality issues, just waiting for QPQ. --Al Ameer (talk) 21:42, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

Clairmarais aerodrome

Clairmarais aerodrome in July 1918
Clairmarais aerodrome in July 1918
  • ... that the First World War Clairmarais aerodrome in France was utilised by the Luftwaffe from 1940 but proved to be unusable in wet weather? Source: "Sep 40: assigned airfield code number 383. Came under Koflug 8/III" "level grass surface that was unserviceable in wet weather" Luftwaffe Airfields 1935-45 France (with Corsica and Channel Islands) by Henry L. deZeng IV page 334-335
    • ALT1:... that a corrugated iron hanger at Clairmarais aerodrome was disguised as a church? Source: "had a small corrugated iron hangar disguised as a church" Luftwaffe Airfields 1935-45 France (with Corsica and Channel Islands) by Henry L. deZeng IV page 335
    • ALT2:... that First World War Australian flying ace Harry Cobby made almost half of his kills whilst based at Clairmarais aerodrome (pictured)?

Created by Pigsonthewing (talk) and Alansplodge (talk). Nominated by Dumelow (talk) at 21:38, 12 November 2018 (UTC).

Hi Andy. Happy to go with a WWI hook, though I couldn't find anything much more exciting than the one hook I proposed above. Perhaps you have a better suggestion? - Dumelow (talk) 23:08, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Natan Yavlinsky

Cutaway diagram of the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor (ITER), the largest tokamak in the world projected to begin operation by 2035.
Cutaway diagram of the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor (ITER), the largest tokamak in the world projected to begin operation by 2035.

Created by Arius1998 (talk). Self-nominated at 03:07, 7 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 7

Dan Crenshaw

Moved to mainspace by Muboshgu (talk). Self-nominated at 19:31, 7 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Article is new enough, long enough, neutral, and well referenced. Hook is interesting, neutral, and supported with references. No copyvio found. Awaiting QPQ. -Zanhe (talk) 20:48, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Zanhe: You're too quick. I'm working on making sure other articles of newly elected candidates are up to snuff. Ping me in a week if I still haven't provided QPQ. – Muboshgu (talk) 22:34, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
No problem. Take your time. -Zanhe (talk) 01:02, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
@Zanhe: QPQ is done. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:40, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

Joe Cunningham (American politician)

  • Reviewed: IOU

Moved to mainspace by Muboshgu (talk). Self-nominated at 18:26, 14 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 8

Bleed India with a Thousand Cuts

Created by DBigXray (talk). Self-nominated at 20:46, 14 November 2018 (UTC).

French submarine Z

Z, date unknown
Z, date unknown
  • ... that the French submarine Z was ordered as France's first diesel-powered submarine, but lost this distinction because the French submarine Aigrette was launched before? Source: page 208 of Robert Gardiner; Randal Gray (1985). Conway's All the World's Fighting Ships, 1906-1921. London: Conway Maritime Press. ISBN 978-0-85177-245-5.

Created by L293D (talk). Self-nominated at 02:59, 11 November 2018 (UTC).

The source doesn't support the claim you are making - it says Z was the first French diesel submarine, not the first diesel submarine in total - discussion of Aigrette is on page 208, not 207.Nigel Ish (talk) 13:05, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
@Nigel Ish: fixed. L293D ( • ) 03:18, 12 November 2018 (UTC)

Team Taisan

Team Taisan's 2012 championship-winning Porsche.
Team Taisan's 2012 championship-winning Porsche.
  • ... that since 1994 Team Taisan has won eight team championships and four drivers championships in the Super GT Series? Source: "Team Taisan have won a total of 28 races between the first and second classes of the JGTC/Super GT from 1994-2014 and 2016-2018, and can claim at least a share of four GT300 Drivers’ Championships, seven GT300 Teams’ Championships, and one GT1 (GT500) Teams’ Championship." [29]

Created by The359 (talk). Self-nominated at 01:51, 11 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg good, long enough, no copyvios obvious, hook cited, short enough and image appropriately licensed. However, the hook is confusing to me because it reads like Team Taisan won eight teams, which make no sense. I suppose that you wanted to say the team won eight team championships and four driver championships. Could you please reword it a bit? Additionally, the image is not used in the article, a requirement for DYK. L293D ( • ) 02:52, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I did not know about the photo requirement, I substituted this photo for the DYK because I felt it was clearer at a smaller scale, but I have now changed it to match the one in the article. I also agree the hook was difficult to understand, I have modified it. The359 (Talk) 04:16, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @The359: hook is good now. The previous image was better in my opinion, so why not add it to the photo gallery in the article? L293D ( • ) 15:20, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I have added the photograph back to the hook and added it to the article. The359 (Talk) 21:26, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

Treat Myself

  • ... that Meghan Trainor delayed her album Treat Myself because she wanted to add more songs to it?

5x expanded by Ss112 (talk). Nominated by MaranoFan (talk) at 08:55, 10 November 2018 (UTC).

Sexy Zone (song)

Created by Explicit (talk). Self-nominated at 02:47, 10 November 2018 (UTC).

List of Category 3 Atlantic hurricanes

Satellite image of Hurricane Ophelia in 2017, the most recent storm to peak as a Category 3 Atlantic hurricane
Satellite image of Hurricane Ophelia in 2017, the most recent storm to peak as a Category 3 Atlantic hurricane
  • ... that there have been 162 Atlantic hurricanes that reached a peak intensity of Category 3 on the Saffir-Simpson scale? Source: National Hurricane Center
    • ALT1:... that four hurricanes were responsible for more than half of the 18,361 fatalities caused by 162 Category 3 Atlantic hurricanes? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)
  • Reviewed: Antonio Delgado (politician)
  • Comment: For Alt1, there would be too many sources to list all of the deaths. They are listed after each storm. If there are doubts about the veracity, then I would go with the first hook, which is a little more bland.

Created by Hurricanehink (talk) and NotSparta (talk). Nominated by Hurricanehink (talk) at 19:26, 8 November 2018 (UTC).

Young Voters for the President

Richard Nixon campaigning in 1972
Richard Nixon campaigning in 1972

Created by Chetsford (talk). Self-nominated at 07:40, 8 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg The article was created and nominated on the same day (Nov 8). However, it has 1471 characters, which is just below the required 1,500.--Երևանցի talk 15:37, 10 November 2018 (UTC)

Peng Shilu

Peng Shilu in 2004
Peng Shilu in 2004
  • ... that Peng Shilu is known as the "father of China's nuclear submarines" while Huang Xuhua was then one of his three deputies, and he was jailed at 8 years old for being the son of someone? Source: (a) pages 322–323 of Historical Dictionary of Science and Technology in Modern China. Rowman & Littlefield Publishers. 2015. ISBN 978-0-8108-7855-6., (b) pages 55-79 of "China's Future Nuclear Submarine Force — Insights from Chinese Writings" (PDF). Naval War College Review. 60 (1). Winter 2007. ISSN 0028-1484., (c) "The achievements of CNNC during the year 2017". www.china5e.com (in Chinese).
  • Reviewed: exempt from QPQ

Created by Lvhis (talk). Self-nominated at 19:46, 8 November 2018 (UTC).

  • .

Articles created/expanded on November 9

Ústredňa Židov

  • ... that the Slovak Jewish Council was taken over by a resistance group, despite having been set up by the Nazis? Source: Nazis forcing the Jews to form the group, Fatran 1994, p. 165.; for the takeover, Fatran 1994, pp. 187–188.

Created by Catrìona (talk) and The Anome (talk). Nominated by Catrìona (talk) at 22:30, 9 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg @Catrìona and The Anome: I'm trying to review this article but I'm coming up against a question of eligibility. Looking at the edit history it was created on 1 October with material copied from Bratislava Working Group, virtually blanked on 9 November and then re-written. The two versions don't seem to be fundamentally different however. Apart from this, I also have a query in regards to Slovak Jewish Council. The term, while used in the hook, is not used in the article, only Jewish Council is used but, according to the intro, the translation for Ústredňa Židov is Jewish Center. Could you please shed some light on these two queries? Turismond (talk) 23:52, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I may have found the answer to my first question. Was it moved to mainspace on 9 November, which would make it eligible? As to further reviewing the article, article and hook length, neutrality and QPQ are ok. No copyright violations found. Offline sources accepted in good faith. I'm struggling however to find was taken over by a resistance group, despite having been set up by the Nazis in the article (other than the intro), all I can find is effectively uniting the Working Group and the ÚŽ, which is unreferenced. Could a the article be amended to include a referenced version of the hook's statement? Turismond (talk) 01:15, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

Poèmes pour Mi

  • ... that Poèmes pour Mi is a song cycle by Olivier Messian, in which he set his own poems for a grand soprano dramatique and piano or orchestra, dedicated to his wife (couple pictured)? Source: several

Created by LouisAlain (talk) and Gerda Arendt (talk). Nominated by Gerda Arendt (talk) at 15:25, 15 November 2018 (UTC).

The Eucalyptus

  • ... that the original The Eucalyptus restaurant in Jerusalem was constructed around a living tree? Source: "In 1960, as a young man, Chef Moshe Basson planted a eucalyptus tree in the yard next to his family's small stone house in the southern Jerusalem neighborhood of Talpiot. Twenty-five years later, he built a restaurant around the tree, with its branches shooting through the ceiling, surprisingly enough naming it Eucalyptus." (The Jerusalem Post)

Created by E.M.Gregory (talk). Nominated by Yoninah (talk) at 00:44, 13 November 2018 (UTC).

  • General eligiblity:

Policy compliance:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Consider looking for review sources that might provide some balance? valereee (talk) 14:48, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

  • @Valereee: thank you for the quick review. I have already edited the page but have not removed the tag yet. What close paraphrasing are you talking about? Earwig's shows nothing. Yoninah (talk) 14:53, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Hi, Yoninah The read of the article sourced sounded very similar to me, but I didn't parse it line by line, so earwig is good enough for me! Let me go edit it for a minute, brb valereee (talk) 15:10, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Hi, Yoninah To be honest, a second read still felt like promotional copy, but I am having a hard time putting my finger on it as the language used is definitely sourced accurately. Perhaps it's that there are no sources that seem to criticize anything. Did you find any sources that were critical? A quick check found a rave from Forbes -- do you know of any that provided critical review? I did remove the tage valereee (talk) 15:27, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Valereee: I nominated this yesterday to make the 7-day deadline, but I would appreciate a little more time to expand it with reliable refs. I provided a bunch of good refs to the page creator to build the page more encyclopedically. Could you give us some more time? Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 15:31, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Of course! No rush! I only chose it because I was looking for a restaurant article to review and your hook hooked me :) valereee (talk) 15:35, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Valereee:, I'm puzzled as to why you removed the improvement tag after saying that you yourself consider it unbalanced. Deb (talk) 15:44, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Deb I was looking at WP:DYKNOT and thinking that for purposes of DYK, an article doesn't need to be perfect. Does a tag disqualify? If not, happy to add it back. Oh, are we commenting in the wrong spot? I'll move the line. valereee (talk) 16:00, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
  • A new article, Moshe Basson, has just been created and we would like to propose this double hook:
  • ALT1: ... that chef Moshe Basson forages for wild plants and herbs in the Jerusalem hills to use in his traditional regional dishes at The Eucalyptus restaurant?
  • The QPQ for 2 articles should cover both these nominations.
  • However, Deb has pointed out some duplication between the articles, so we need another day or two to fix that up. @Valereee: I'll let you know when we're ready for re-review. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 11:15, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Yoninah I assume I need to review Moshe Basson as well as The Eucalyptus? Do I move a second template in? Or do you start a second entry? valereee (talk) 11:00, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Valeree: You don't have to review Moshe Basson if you don't want to. (We'll just call for another reviewer.) But if you want to do it, your review can continue on this template. But please hold tight — both articles are still undergoing revision. I'll let you know when we're ready. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 16:44, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  • No worries at all, I wasn't trying to noodge! I was asking because I'm happy to do Moshe Basson too, and I'd like to do another because I've got three DYK up myself and am looking for a third article because although those are only my 2nd, 3rd, and 4th DYKs I'd just kind of like to keep up. valereee (talk) 17:20, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

Dena Vane-Kirkman

  • ... that when magazine editor Dena Vane-Kirkman was robbed at gunpoint by a burglar, she told him "Your mother would be ashamed of you"?
    • ALT1:... that ...?
  • Reviewed: To be done

Created by Philafrenzy (talk). Self-nominated at 18:48, 12 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg The article, while new and long enough, has a few issues. The red links are a bit of an eyesore. I would shorten the lead to, "Dena Lesley Vane-Kirkman (1 May 1944 – 19 October 2018) was a British magazine editor, best known for her work on Woman's World in New York in the 1980s". There's also the troubling fact that hardly any results turn up for "Dena Vane-Kirkman" on internet searches. There's the Times obituary (behind a pay wall) and then this article. That's pretty much it. There's this notice for her funeral, which is cited in the article. Clearly not a reliable source. Sorry but I highly doubt she meets notability criteria. - HappyWaldo (talk) 22:38, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
The Times gave her a full page obituary, they don't do that for everyone, and the other sources (Dena Vane) are in journals such as Marketing, many of which are offline or behind paywalls too because they are recent. I will find some more and add them. Philafrenzy (talk) 23:15, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

Saint Gregory the Illuminator Church of Galata

Saint Gregory the Illuminator Church of Galata
Saint Gregory the Illuminator Church of Galata
  • ... that the St. Gregory the Illuminator Church of Galata is the only of Istanbul's more than 30 Armenian churches to have been built in the traditional Armenian style? Source: "Պոլսոյ մէջ հայ դասական ոճով կառուցուած միակ եկեղեցին է։ [30]; "The conical-domed structure was not seen in Constantinople except for the pre-Ottoman church of Surp Krikor Lusavoric of Karakoy." [31])
    • ALT1:... that an Armenian church in Istanbul was demolished in 1958 and rebuilt years later half as wide, to make way for the street? "Zira kilise için kalan yer, eski alanın neredeyse yarısı genişliğinde olduğundan..." [32])

Created by Yerevantsi (talk). Self-nominated at 19:27, 9 November 2018 (UTC).

Wayne Matthews

Created by Kosack (talk). Self-nominated at 19:28, 9 November 2018 (UTC).

Ameenpur Lake

Migratory birds at Ameenpur Lake
Migratory birds at Ameenpur Lake
  • ... that Ameenpur Lake is the first water body in India and also the first site in an urban environment that has been declared as a biodiversity heritage site...? Source: "[33]" [34]""(and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)
    • ALT1:... that " (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

Created by Sarvagyana guru (talk). Self-nominated at 11:12, 9 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 10

Erin Zwiener

  • Reviewed: IOU

Created by Muboshgu (talk). Self-nominated at 05:24, 13 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Article created within the last seven days, is just over the required prose size and has no copyvio concerns. Hooks are interesting and supported by inline citations to reliable sources. Just waiting for the QPQ, I know you're putting a lot forward so ready to go when you get round to it. Kosack (talk) 09:35, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
      • I've got some time later today, so I was planning on pumping out all my QPQs. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:28, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Ugaritic texts

List of the Gods of Ugarit
List of the Gods of Ugarit
  • ... that the most famous Ugaritic texts are epic poems called the Baal cycle, the Legend of Keret and the Tale of Aqhat? Source: Schniedewind & Hunt, 2007, pages 26 and 117: "Three major literary texts—the Baal Cycle, the Keret Legend, and the Tale of Aqhat—have been discovered in Ugarit. These materials form the major, and perhaps the most significant, portion of the Ugaritic alphabetic corpus... Most of the major literary texts from Ugaritic are in the form of narrative poems. Included here are selections from the three most famous poems: the Baal Cycle, the Keret Epic, and the Story of Aqhat."

Created by Onceinawhile (talk). Self-nominated at 22:21, 10 November 2018 (UTC).

Symbol question.svg Interesting history, on good sources, no copyvio obvious. The image is stunning, but I think the other one would show in small size. Can you replace "famous" by something else? In the article, you will have to add references to all paragraphs. Can you combine one-sentence paragraphs? - A suggestion: the introduction should just be a summary, and then doesn't need references. Could you move the content to below, including the refs, and write a summary? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:22, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
Thank you for your thoughtful comments. I will work through these. I have started by replacing the photo - what do you think of this one? I have also amended the hook to replace the word “famous”. Onceinawhile (talk) 19:28, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
ALT1: ... that the best-known Ugaritic texts are epic poems called the Baal cycle, the Legend of Keret and the Tale of Aqhat?
I like the image better. Next time, don't "amend" the hook, but write an ALT, - or the conversation makes little sense ;) - I did it for you. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:46, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
As you didn't object I'll approve that version once all paragraphs come with a reference. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:53, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 11

Marj Heyduck

  • ... that Dayton Daily News columnist Marj Heyduck was photographed in a different hat for each of her daily columns, for a total of over 2500 different hats and photos? Mickey Davis for DDN "Try 2,776 different hats, 2,776 different photos" [35]
    • ALT1:... that Dayton Daily News columnist Marj Heyduck once took Gorgeous George to have his famous blond locks restyled by her hairdresser? Al&Marge for DDN "Marj decided he needed a new hairdo. So "The Woman in the Hat" took Gorgeous George to her hairdresser for a fancy perm. Gorgeous George and his blond locks became popular around the world." [36]

Created by Valereee (talk). Self-nominated at 10:18, 16 November 2018 (UTC).

Roz Young

  • ... that Roz Young's column appeared opposite the Editorial page in the Dayton Daily News at a time when most women writers were relegated to the women's pages? ”She began her career in journalism at a time when women writers were confined to the women’s pages” Dayton Daily News August 19 2005 Editorial page [37]
    • ALT1:... that columnist Roz Young often assessed 25-cent fines to Dayton Daily News colleagues who allowed grammatical errors to make it into print? ”She instituted a system of 25-cent fines for every grammaticalerro” Source: Bill Wild for the Dayton Daily News Aug 21 2005 [38]
    • ALT2:... that Roz Young often mentioned her cat, Edith, in her popular Dayton Daily News column? ”Followers of Young’s Sunday editorial page columns have seen the devoted couple through a season of life changes.” Laura Dempsey for the Dayton Daily News Dec 6 1996 [39]

Created by Valereee (talk). Self-nominated at 19:02, 13 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Non-free files like File:Roz young 1991.jpeg can only be used in the article namespace per WP:NFCC#9; they cannot be used in templates, etc. like this, so the file has been removed from this page. -- Marchjuly (talk) 02:04, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Oh, sorry, I didn't know! Thanks for removing! valereee (talk) 09:29, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Ugh, and I just realized I probably have put this in the wrong place...the article was created on the 11th, not yesterday. Should I move it? valereee (talk) 10:45, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
Okay, moved it valereee (talk) 11:06, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Agnes Ballard

Ballard in 1920
Ballard in 1920
  • ... that Agnes Ballard (pictured) was the first woman licensed as an architect in Florida in 1914, and the first woman elected to public office in Florida in 1920? Source: "She was the first woman licensed architect in the state of Florida...in 1914..." from [40] and "The first Florida woman elected to office...was Miss Agnes Ballard, who was chosen Palm Beach county superintendent of public instruction" from [41] (note latter source misreports the year, other sources in article are clear it is 1920)
    • ALT1:... that Agnes Ballard (pictured) of Florida was both the first woman licensed as an architect and the first woman elected to public office in that state?

Created by Krelnik (talk). Self-nominated at 02:46, 15 November 2018 (UTC).

Symbol question.svg Interesting life, on excellent sources, no copyvio obvious. The image is licensed and shows decently in small size. - Sorry, I don't lie these "first - first" hooks. I am surprised that there's not much talk in the article about what she designed as an architectm but think "apartments, residences and hot dog stands" would sound interesting, combined with one "first" perhaps. - I formatted the pictured-clause for you. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:05, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Class of 2018

Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro
Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro
  • ... that the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018 is the first-starring role of Sharlene San Pedro and Nash Aguas (pictured), who used to do sketch comedy in the variety show Goin' Bulilit when they were little...? Source: "Former “Goin’ Bulilit” stars will reunite in the upcoming action thriller “Class of 2018." (link)
    • ALT1:... that the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018's director Charliebebs Gohetia chose Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro (pictured) as the lead cast because he believes people want them to work together as a love team...? Source: "we decided ‘Okay let’s give it to Nash and Sharlene.’ It turns out there has been a clamor for their love team" (link)
    • ALT2:... that the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018 is a fulfilment of the NashLene fans' (derived from the names of the lead cast Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro (pictured) wish...? Source: "The movie is kind of a dream come true for NashLene fans because they’ve been crying for the two young artists to have a love tandem on screen." (link)
    • ALT3:... that the main cast of 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018 were the same people who used to do sketch comedy in the variety show Goin' Bulilit when they were little....? Source: same as main hook.

Created by 001Jrm (talk). Self-nominated at 08:13, 11 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Thanks for claiming, I guess. ^^ Here's my pre-comment: ALT1 and ALT2 may sound fancruft-y but I can't say the same for the main hook/ALT3. The main cast started young (like kids aged 4yrs up) and they had a show (Goin Bulilit) wherein they do comedy and sitcom. The same kids (who are now 19 yrs up) were given the lead roles for the first time and it's action-thriller (so much different from comedy). Fun fact: Usually in the Philippines, rom-com or coming-of-age genre is given for actors' first starring films (link of the actress explaining how people hope for them to do a coming-of-age film) because moviegoers tend to want to watch it more than suspense/action/thriller. That's also the reason why "love teams" are a thing in the country; thus, ALT1 and ALT2). SO I think my hooks are based on plain facts, which I just reworded to make it more interesting. Thanks! :) 001Jrm (talk) 07:30, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
Another issue is that these hooks might be interesting to a broad audience. As a Filipino myself, the hooks focusing on Goin' Bulilit (obscure outside of the country) may not work out for international tastes. I'd suggest you try proposing hooks that don't involve Goin' Bulilit or the love team. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:28, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • How 'bout...
  • ALT4:... that the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018's director Charliebebs Gohetia describes his film as a first in the Philippine cinema because he reinvented the genre in which he mixed multiple genres into one film?
  • ALT5:... that Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro (pictured), who were given their first-starring roles in the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018, were initially told they were going to play the second lead characters? 001Jrm (talk) 05:09, 14 November 2018 (UTC)


A dharani
A dharani
  • ... that the Buddhist Dhāraṇī (pictured) found in a Korean temple are the oldest known printed texts in the world?
    Source: [1] Joseph Needham; Tsien Tsuen-Hsuin (1985). Science and Civilisation in China: Volume 5, Chemistry and Chemical Technology, Part 1, Paper and Printing. Cambridge University Press. p. 150. ISBN 978-0-521-08690-5., Quote: "The specimen found in Korea predates the dharani charm from Japan printed c. +764–70, and which until recently was considered to be the world's oldest extant example of printing. That there were a million copies of the charm in Japan is recorded in several contemporary documents, which also relate that in +764 a copy of one of the four versions of dharani was placed in every one of a million tiny wooden pagodas [...] The text is from the same sutra as the one recently discovered in Korea, but the latter consists only of the prayers in Chinese characters transliterated from the Sanskrit, while the scroll from Korea is much longer [...]";
    [2] Robert E. Buswell (2004). Encyclopedia of Buddhism. Macmillan Reference. p. 676. ISBN 978-0-02-865720-2., Quote: "The earliest examples of Buddhist printing involve a type of charm or spell called a dharani. To date, the oldest printed material that has been discovered is the Korean Mugu chonggwang taedarani kyong";
    [3] Allen Kent; Harold Lancour; Jay E. Daily (1978). Encyclopedia of Library and Information Science: Volume 24 - Printers and Printing. CRC Press. p. 77. ISBN 978-0-8247-2024-7., Quote: "The oldest extant specimens of such prints were not found in China, but in Japan and Korea. In Japan it is the dharani customarily referred to as the hyakumanto, and in Korea, a dharani discovered in 1966 at the Pulguksa temple in Kyongju.";
    [4] P.L. Chau (2001). "Why didn't flood of print launch science in China?". Nature. 409 (8 February): 662., Quote: "The earliest surviving example of printed text is a 'dharani sutra' scroll printed between 704 and 751, now kept in Pulguksa Temple, Kyongju, Korea, and the earliest extant example of a printed book is the Diamond Sutra of 868, now kept in the British Museum.";
    [5] British Library, The Million Pagoda Charms, Quote: "The Hyakumantō darani were long thought to be the world’s oldest surviving printed items but in 1966 a similar dharani was discovered in a stone pagoda at Pulguksa Temple in Korea. Although it is undated it is believed to date from some time before 751 when the stone pagoda was completed."
    • ALT1:... that the world's oldest printed texts are Dhāraṇī composed in Indian Sanskrit, written in transliterated scripts, printed using Chinese methods, and preserved in Korean and Japanese Buddhist temples?
      Source: Peter Francis Kornicki (2018). Languages, Scripts, and Chinese Texts in East Asia. Oxford University Press. pp. 112–117. ISBN 978-0-19-879782-1.
    • ALT2:... that the world's oldest printed texts are 8th-century Buddhist charms called Dhāraṇī (pictured) preserved in Korean and Japanese temples?
      Source: Mark Edward Lewis (2009). China’s Cosmopolitan Empire. Harvard University Press. p. 238. ISBN 978-0-674-03306-1., Quote: "The earliest surviving printed texts are eighth-century samples of Buddhist charms preserved in Korea and Japan. The oldest is a scroll discovered in 1966 in a stone stupa in the Pulguk-sa temple in Kyongju, Korea. [...] Another specimen of the same scroll printed between 764 and 770 has been preserved in Japan."
  • Reviewed: Comic Arts Brooklyn

5x expanded by Ms Sarah Welch (talk). Nominated by Ms Sarah Welch (talk) at 02:30, 11 November 2018 (UTC).

  • General eligiblity:
  • New Enough: Red XN - According to DYKcheck, "Assuming article is at 5x now, expansion began 67 edits ago on November 2, 2018". The article should have been nominated before 9 November and posted in the 2 November date slot. However, given the length of the article I am willing to cut the nominator some slack on that point.
  • Long Enough: Green tickY
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol possible vote.svg Recommend IAR the nomination date and going with the original hook, as most interesting. Catrìona (talk) 02:07, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Catriona: Thank you! The article belongs to our religion space, and it is a bit sensitive given it shows how charms / spells / magic incantations / amulets were a big part of East Asian, South Asian, and Southeast Asian Buddhism by at least some 1,500 years ago. I felt it was more important to get the NPOV/balance aspects addressed first, rather than rush the article for a DYK nom. If admins/evaluators deem that the delay is unacceptable and reject this nom on technical grounds, I understand. I cheerfully support and accept the rejection. I am also too busy in RL at work and home with kids who are more interested in Bishzilla and other "very important" things! If the ~2 day filing delay for this article that went from about 4.6K to 72K expansion is accepted per IAR, I feel it might be an interesting DYK. I do want to thank JimRenge for watching and the encouragement. Thank you once again for the review. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 01:08, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 12

White-crested turaco, Bannerman's turaco

  • ... that the white-crested turaco has a wider range than Bannerman's turaco, perhaps because it was able to adapt to new habitats when climate change reduced forest cover? Source: "T. leucolophus has maintained a much larger range, perhaps by adapting to savanna and submontane habitats."

5x expanded by Cwmhiraeth (talk). Self-nominated at 14:49, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

David Hughson

  • ... that in 1805, David Hughson perambulated around London?
    • ALT1:... that ...?

Created by Philafrenzy (talk) and Whispyhistory (talk). Nominated by Philafrenzy (talk) at 23:45, 17 November 2018 (UTC).

Sam Lek of Donwun

  • ... that Gen. Sam Lek of Hanthawaddy retook Donwun with just 300 troops by employing the same ruse used by the rebel forces to seize the town a year earlier? Source: (Pan Hla 2005: 57, 61)
    • ALT1:... that Viceroy-General Sam Lek of Donwun was defeated by the forces of King Razadarit of Hanthawaddy after the viceroy was betrayed by his thwethauk brother? Source: (Pan Hla 2005: 172–173), (Fernquest 2006: 7); (Harvey 1925: 178) on the definition of thwethauk brother.

Created by Hybernator (talk). Self-nominated at 20:00, 17 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 13

Bedford Presbyterian Church (New York)

Bedford Presbyterian Church
Bedford Presbyterian Church
  • Reviewed: Kilbroney Park
  • Comment: ALT1 for Saint Nicholas, 6 December

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 13:16, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 14

Shukri al-Asali

Portrait of Shukri al-Asali prior to his execution in 1916
Portrait of Shukri al-Asali prior to his execution in 1916
  • Reviewed: Pending

Created by George Al-Shami (talk) and Al Ameer son (talk). Nominated by Al Ameer son (talk) at 19:38, 21 November 2018 (UTC).

Phantasy Quartet

  • ... that Benjamin Britten composed the oboe quartet Phantasy, Op. 2, as a student, and it became the work to win him international recognitione? Source: several
  • Reviewed: Agnes Ballard
  • Comment: this would be best on the composer's birthday, 22 November, but I forgot

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 09:44, 21 November 2018 (UTC).

Leonard Hall (socialist)

Hall in 1895
Hall in 1895
  • ... that Leonard Hall (pictured), a leader of the British Independent Labour Party, worked as a cowboy in the United States? Source: "Leonard Hall was first employed as a parcel-boy in 1879, then successively as a printer's boy, sailor and, during a visit to the United States, as a cowboy." (Crick, 1994)

Created by Warofdreams (talk). Self-nominated at 01:15, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg Hi Warofdreams, review follows: article created 14 November; article exceeds minimum length; article is well written and cited inline throughout to reliable sources; all sources are offline so I have assumed in good faith that there has been no copyright violation from these; hook fact is interesting and the cowboy cited in the article, again I am happy to AGF that the source used backs this up (the extract given above appears to do so); however I think it might be a little misleading to say "a leader of the British Independent Labour Party" - this would be construed as him being the leader of the party which the article doesn't say he was. Could this be rephrased to "a leading member of the..."? Image is freely licensed and used in the article; QPQ has been done. This looks good to go if my query about "leader" is resolved - Dumelow (talk) 23:55, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Bette Korber

  • ... that Bette Korber created a database at Los Alamos National Laboratory that has enabled her to design novel mosaic HIV vaccines, one of which is currently in human testing in Africa? Santa Fe New Mexican

Edge, S. (December 2, 2017). "LANL biologist 'cautiously' optimistic about HIV vaccine". Santa Fe New Mexican. Retrieved September 28, 2018.

  • ALT1:...that Bette Korber developed a novel mosaic HIV vaccine that may slow or prevent HIV infection and is currently in human testing in Africa?"Santa Fe New Mexican
  • ALT2:...that Bette Korberhas described the creation of mosaic test proteins as her making "sort of little Frankenstein proteins that look and feel like HIV proteins but they don’t exist in nature"? Sainani, K. (2009). "Evolution and HIV: Using computational phylogenetics to close in on a killer". Biomedical Computation Review. Symbios, the NIH National Center for Physics-based Simulation of Biological Structures. pp. 20–31.
  • ALT3:...that American computational biologist Bette Korber's work on creating HIV vaccines was partially driven by a close friend contracting one of the first cases of AIDS in Pasadena, CA? "McEnerny, R. (2010), "Tracking HIV Evolution", IAVI Report, 14 (3), pp. 4–9.

Improved to Good Article status by LLMHoopes, Dr. Laura Hoopes (talk). Nominated by LLMHoopes (talk) at 20:24, 15 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Comment: This page was incorrectly transcluded by the nominator. I have fixed the error on the nominations page. feminist (talk) 03:37, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

Joseph Forbes (educator)

  • ... that Joseph Forbes taught boxing champion Jack Dempsey in Colorado? Source: Grandpa Was a Polygamist by Paul Bailey
    • ALT1:... that citizens of American Fork, Utah celebrated Forbes day in celebration of Joseph Forbes's 54-year teaching career? Source: Grandpa Was a Polygamist by Paul Bailey
    • ALT2:... that after Joseph Forbes was arrested for illegal cohabitation, his first wife went to live in a different state to avoid a second arrest?Source: Grandpa Was a Polygamist by Paul Bailey
  • Reviewed: Nichika_Ōmori
  • Comment: I don't have exact quotes for the hooks, but I can find them again. The page was recently nominated for speedy deletion, which I contest! Please do not review until the deletion nomination is resolved.

Created by Rachel Helps (BYU) (talk). Self-nominated at 22:23, 14 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg This article has been deleted. So uncontroversial to fail and close this nomination. Joseph2302 (talk) 19:33, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I believe the speedy deletion was made in error, as the page is considerably different from the first version that was deleted. Rachel Helps (BYU) (talk) 19:47, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Shirt58: where is the deletion discussion for this article, and is the newly created version sufficiently identical to the deleted version? Rachel Helps (BYU), if Shirt58 does not respond, consider taking this to WP:DRV. feminist (talk) 03:31, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg Marking as "maybe" as the article creator is an experienced editor and the ineligibility of the nomination has been contested. feminist (talk) 03:33, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
@Rachel Helps (BYU) and Feminist: The WP:AFD was Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Joseph Barlow Forbes. As always, please let me know if I can help in any way. Pete AU aka Shirt58 (talk) 10:39, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
Thank you. If there is non-trivial difference between the version created by Rachel Helps (BYU) and the deleted version, the G4 deletion may be inappropriate (but as a non-admin, I can't judge). There are two possible approaches: the first is to restore the G4-deleted article to draft space, then take this to WP:DRV; the second is to restore the article in mainspace then immediately take it to WP:AFD. feminist (talk) 10:55, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
@Shirt58: is the G4-deleted version of Joseph Forbes (educator) substantially similar in content to Joseph Barlow Forbes? If not, would you mind undeleting it and placing it in draft space? c (talk) 10:26, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
Yes, my argument is that the page did not qualify for speedy deletion, as the most recently deleted version was substantially different from the one covered under the original deletion discussion. I added several sources which I believe fulfill Wikipedia's notability guidelines. Rachel Helps (BYU) (talk) 16:11, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

─────────────────────────Hello @Rachel Helps (BYU) and Feminist:, Simething odd is going on wirh ny computer keyboard, I;ll need to sort that out. In the mean time,

deleted versions

My apologies fo the delay. Pete AU aka Shirt58 (talk) 09:15, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. Based on the restored versions I'd say the G4 deletion was inappropriate. However, I agree that this is borderline for notability. Most of the coverage was from two books written by the subject's grandson. Rachel Helps (BYU), consider taking this to WP:DRV if you want this to be kept. feminist (talk) 11:04, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
I dunno about that. Shirt58 brought this to my attention as the closer of the AfD, and after looking at both versions, I don't think it really passes G4. It clearly started as an exact copy, and the meat of the new changes occurred over these diffs. I went through the new draft and removed all the sentences that were exact copies from the original, and that's mostly it. In my view, it's not enough to make it substantially different, especially when looking at the AfD. The new version clearly introduces new sources, which is enough to at least consider whether it should be overturned given the concerns at AfD, but I don't think the new sources or content push up against the notability issues. At any rate, I agree with Feminist that WP:DRV is the perfect venue for this if you want to contest the G4 Rachel Helps (BYU). ~ Amory (utc) 16:17, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
@Amorymeltzer: Looking at this article's history again, what's interesting is that this was restored as a draft after AfD, expanded somewhat, accepted (by a blocked editor) at AfC, then speedy deleted. The best an admin could have done in this situation would have been to move this back to draft space and refer the article expander to DRV. This article should not have been mainspaced without a DRV discussion, unless GNG is so obvious as to not require discussion (which is the case with e.g. the Incel article, but not here). feminist (talk) 16:35, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Current nominations

Articles created/expanded on November 15

Serra antwren

5x expanded by Cwmhiraeth (talk). Self-nominated at 09:34, 22 November 2018 (UTC).

Kenya Coast Guard Service

  • ... that the Kenya Coast Guard Service commissioned its first vessel on 19 November 2018? Source: "This vessel - the MV Doria - is the Kenyan coastguard's first and only boat" (BBC News) "President Uhuru Kenyatta is on Monday scheduled to unveil the Kenya Coast Guard Service unit tasked with protection and enforcement of laws in Kenya's internal and territorial waters. During the launch, State House stated that President Kenyatta will also commission MV Doria" (All Africa)

Created by Dumelow (talk) and Fsmatovu (talk). Nominated by Dumelow (talk) at 12:53, 21 November 2018 (UTC).

Victor Mallet visa controversy

  • ... that ...? a journalist who chaired a talk by the leader of the now banned Hong Kong National Party was denied renewal of his work permit on November 9.
    • ALT1:... that ...? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)
  • Reviewed: It's been a while since I nominated a DYK article, but I have a few articles "in the bank", as the saying goes...
  • Comment: This is a pending nomination wth a holding hook

Created by Ohconfucius (talk). Self-nominated at 21:57, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

Solar storm of August 1972

Solar flare, August 1972
Solar flare, August 1972

Created by SusanLesch (talk) and Evolauxia (talk). Nominated by Evolauxia (talk) at 20:06, 18 November 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Green tickY
  • Interesting: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Red XN - The hooks need to be shorter; all of them are over 200 characters and ALT1 is almost 300. Also, only one ellipsis is needed, and perhaps run a grammar check (I think a few commas need to be added, but the content itself looks fine).
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol possible vote.svg The article itself also may need a bit of work in syntax, grammar, and formatting, though it is well-cited and covers the most important points. A shortened version of ALT1 with these changes looks promising for DYK. Indeed, that hook caught my interest when browsing this page to do a review. ComplexRational (talk) 22:41, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Adruti Laxmibai

5x expanded by Naga sai sravanth (talk). Self-nominated at 11:59, 18 November 2018 (UTC).

Macrozamia riedlei

pollen cones of Macrozamia riedlei
pollen cones of Macrozamia riedlei
  • ... that the cycad species Macrozamia riedlei (pollen cones pictured) was possibly responsible for poisoning Dutch sailors in 1897 - the earliest for an Australian plant?Source for poisoning. Offline one has earliest for native plant

5x expanded by Casliber (talk), Cygnis insignis (talk), and MargaretRDonald (talk). Nominated by Casliber (talk) at 09:47, 18 November 2018 (UTC).

Cozy Little Christmas

Created by Ss112 (talk). Expanded and nominated by SNUGGUMS (talk) at 22:32, 17 November 2018 (UTC).

Lila Gene George

  • ... that pianist Lila Gene George won $50 for receiving first place in a women's original music composition contest in 1969?
  • Reviewed: Andreas Bauer (bass)
  • Comment: I thought that the hook might be interesting because of what would now be a small sum of money being won from a competition. Maybe it might be more interesting to younger readers though (the 93 in my username refers to my birth year). If the hook isn't acceptable, I can probably easily find a better one.

Created/expanded by SL93 (talk). Self-nominated at 21:04, 15 November 2018 (UTC).

Catra (She-Ra)

Created by Dwaynewest (talk). Nominated by Slargman (talk) at 00:53, 16 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg The hook is not interesting to a broad audience, and discusses an in-universe detail, which is not allowed per DYK rules (hooks about fiction need to relate to the real world). @Dwaynewest and Slargman: A new hook is needed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:55, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 16

Selfish genetic element

5x expanded by Arvidagren (talk). Self-nominated at 18:54, 16 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 17

Geology of Hong Kong

Geological map of Hong Kong. Green is volcanic rocks, red is granitic rocks.
Geological map of Hong Kong. Green is volcanic rocks, red is granitic rocks.
  • ... that volcanoes in Hong Kong started erupting in the Jurassic period? Source: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/249546895_Structure_control_and_tectonic_setting_of_Mesozoic_volcanism_in_Hong_Kong

5x expanded by HarrietHKUGeology (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 21:32, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Crustal evolution

Ejecta from cratering
Ejecta from cratering
  • Reviewed: Winmark
  • Comment: part of the Regional Geology course at HKU

Created by Georgealee (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 11:34, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Archean felsic volcanic rocks

Archean felsic volcanic rock containing fiamme structure
Archean felsic volcanic rock containing fiamme structure
  • ... that all Archean felsic volcanic rocks (sample pictured) are located in greenstone belts? https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/000925419390140E

Moved to mainspace by Ivancyyip (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 04:50, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Analogue modelling (geology)

analogue model of fault tectonics and salt tectonics
analogue model of fault tectonics and salt tectonics

5x expanded by YuweiHGeo (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 04:27, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Hydrothermal mineral deposit

  • Reviewed: Khukri Rum
  • Comment: Part of Regional Geology course at HKU

Created by Alexgiovi (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 22:55, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Northeast Syrtis

  • ... that the Northeast Syrtis region on Mars is a potential target for the Mars 2020 rover mission because it once had flowing water, and diverse kinds of rock units? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

Created by Justinbl (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 23:09, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Optically stimulated luminescence thermochronometry

Electron trapping caused by radiation
Electron trapping caused by radiation

Created by BlessingAdeoti (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 23:24, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Regolith-hosted rare earth element deposits

A regolith-hosted rare earth element deposit mine in South China
A regolith-hosted rare earth element deposit mine in South China
  • ... that regolith-hosted rare earth element deposits are mostly low grade, but because they are cheap to extract, they are economical to mine? Source: https://www.smedg.org.au/Hellman%20and%20Duncan%20REE%20Paper_2017.pdf

Created/expanded by Kevnmh (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 23:48, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Salt deformation

Rock salt in blue deforms and flows upwards under pressure.
Rock salt in blue deforms and flows upwards under pressure.
  • ... that rock salt is a very weak rock, and flows under stress? Source: https://www.nature.com/articles/324554a0
    • ALT1:... that ...? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)
  • Reviewed: Green's law
  • Comment: part of Regional geology class at HKU

Moved to mainspace by Myip003 (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 23:58, 19 November 2018 (UTC).


Tsawela tonalitic gneiss from South Africa
Tsawela tonalitic gneiss from South Africa
  • Reviewed: Erwin Wickert
  • Comment: Part of Regional Geology class at HKU

5x expanded by Adayding (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 00:18, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

Slovak, cast off your parasite!

  • ... that a Catholic priest argued that the Holocaust was consistent with Christian morality in an infamous 1942 speech? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)
  • Reviewed: A719 road
  • Comment: Other variations possible.

Created by Catrìona (talk). Self-nominated at 13:04, 17 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Article is new enough and long enough. I can't access any of the sources with the exception of one which checks out. No indication of copyvio or plagiarism. Catrìona, I have a question about the first hook; is The Holocaust here supposed to refer to the deportation, or was this guy explicitly saying "gas them!"? ALT1 works fine. QPQ is done. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 10:09, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Jo-Jo Eumerus: Thanks for the review; I have pdf copies of Ward and Rajcan et al and would be happy to email them to you if you'd like to check them. Ostensibly, he was referring to the deportations, but as it says in the article, the Slovak leadership knew exactly what was happening to the deported Jews—so one could argue that his speech was also aimed at moderates who were getting wet feet. In addition, the deportations were an integral part of the Holocaust in Slovakia and Jews were extensively mistreated while they were being loaded into the cattle cars by Hlinka Guardsmen. Catrìona (talk) 11:00, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Sure, email me away. My question about the lead hook was more about whether the speech was merely about defending deportation or was explicitly advocating mass murder. Everybody who was "in the know" was aware that deportation was a prelude to gassing/shooting but I am not sure if the people the speech was aimed at knew this. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 15:25, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Oei Tjie Sien

  • ... that the tycoon Oei Tjie Sien (1835-1900) fought in the Taiping Rebellion before moving to colonial Indonesia, where he founded Kian Gwan in 1863, a company that later became Southeast Asia's largest conglomerate in the early decades of the twentieth century? Source:https://books.google.com/books?id=PIgGCwAAQBAJ&pg=PA92&dq=%22oei+tjie+sien%22+%22taiping%22+%22kian+gwan%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwifjKbu6NreAhUJr48KHUZyCY8Q6AEIPjAD#v=onepage&q=%22oei%20tjie%20sien%22%20%22taiping%22%20%22kian%20gwan%22&f=false

Created by ClaraElisaOng (talk). Nominated by ClaraElisaOng (talk) at 06:42, 17 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 18

Joe Nguyen and My-Linh Thai

  • Reviewed: TBD

Created by SounderBruce (talk). Self-nominated at 01:47, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Everything looks good on both articles; I'll give the checkmark for the first hook once the QPQ requirement is met. 28bytes (talk) 03:21, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Brigadier General Thomas F. Barr Award

The 2017 Thomas F. Barr Award trophy
The 2017 Thomas F. Barr Award trophy

Created/expanded by Chetsford (talk). Self-nominated at 14:28, 18 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg Not long enough. Only 1357 characters of readable prose (characters in the table don't count, as I understand it). Ykraps (talk) 08:52, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Theresienstadt concentration camp and the Red Cross

  • ... that the only accurate Red Cross report on Theresienstadt concentration camp was written by a longtime Nazi? Source: Hartmann was a Nazi party member since 1933, Steinacher 2017, pp. 39–40; that his was the only accurate report on Theresienstadt, see Rothkirchen 2006, p. 252.
    • ALT1:... that 7,500 prisoners were sent to Auschwitz in order to "beautify" Theresienstadt concentration camp for a Red Cross inspection?[43]

Moved to mainspace by Catrìona (talk). Self-nominated at 14:00, 18 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 19

First World Congress of Jewish Women

  • ... that the 1923 World Congress of Jewish Women in Vienna unanimously resolved to support the settlement of Jews in Palestine? Source: "In the final resolutions adopted by the Congress, a Palestine proposal was adopted unanimously with great acclamation: 'It appears, therefore, to be the duty of all Jews to co-operate in the social-economic reconstruction of Palestine and to assist in the settlement of Jews in that country.'" (Jewish Women's Archive)

Created by Ipigott (talk). Nominated by Yoninah (talk) at 21:21, 21 November 2018 (UTC).

Cynthia García Coll

  • ... that Cynthia García Coll has shown immigrant children were more likely to graduate if they lived in states that granted TANF benefits to low-income immigrant families?

Source: [44]: "Using data from the 2002 Educational Longitudinal Study, a study of more than 16,000 U.S. school students, one of us, Alexandra Filindra, worked with Cynthia Garcia Coll and David Blanding to explore how these state-level welfare policies affected the children of immigrants. In states that granted TANF to low-income immigrants, graduation rates for children who had at least one foreign-born parent were 5.3 percentage points higher than those in states that excluded them."

Created by QuakerSquirrel (talk). Nominated by 28bytes (talk) at 22:32, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

  •  Working GMGtalk 13:49, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Sorry, I started on this and then got super busy. It's Thanksgiving this weekend in the US. But if I can't get it wrapped up this weekend, I will by Monday at the latest. GMGtalk 22:48, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @GreenMeansGo: No worries! I appreciate the work you've done on it already. Enjoy your Thanksgiving! Cheers, 28bytes (talk) 23:22, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Incidentally, I've shot an email to the subject to see if she can publicly publish fairly mundane personal details in a way that we can cite on Wikipedia. Probably 80% chance she doesn't respond, but we'll see. GMGtalk 00:13, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

Loch Maree Hotel botulism poisoning

Loch Maree Hotel
Loch Maree Hotel
  • Reviewed: To be done

Created by Philafrenzy (talk), Whispyhistory (talk), and Edwardx (talk). Nominated by Philafrenzy (talk) at 22:11, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg - Length and date check, QPQ is pending, Image is PD-Old. For the cite, while this being the first fatal outbreak is mentioned in the lead I do not see a cite for it in the article. Also, there is a clarification needed tag for an unclear sentence and Earwigs flags some close paraphrasing. Mifter (talk) 00:44, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
@Mifter: All done I think. I changed fatal to recorded in the hook as there may well have been earlier unrecognised cases in the U.K. Philafrenzy (talk) 08:44, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
Thanks! Still need the QPQ though. Best, Mifter (talk) 04:24, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

Aurelia Henry Reinhardt

Aurelia Henry Reinhardt, (Pres't Mills College) LCCN2014716751 (cropped).jpg
  • ... that Aurelia Henry Reinhardt was the longest serving president in the history of Mills College, the first female moderator of the American Unitarian Association, and a delegate to the inaugural meeting of the United Nations?
    • Source 1: She was the longest-serving president in the history of Mills College, a woman’s liberal arts college located in Oakland.[45]
    • Source 2: She was the first woman moderator of the American Unitarian Association (1940-1942)[46]
    • Source 3: A member of more than a dozen peace organizations for the next three decades, she served as a delegate to the founding meetings of the United Nations in San Francisco in 1945.[47]
  • Reviewed: Forthcoming

Improved to Good Article status by GreenMeansGo (talk). Self-nominated at 13:16, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

  • This is one of those where you could easily write a 200 word hook, nevermind a 200 character one. I've also been working on a restoration of the lead image, and if we're going to us it, I'll be sure to get it wrapped up before it hits the main page. GMGtalk 20:01, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg - Length, Date, Cites, and Earwigs check. Image is PD-old, all that is needed is a QPQ. Best, Mifter (talk) 22:21, 20 November 2018 (UTC)


  • ... that deschooling was coined by Ivan Illich, who believed that traditional education received by children needed to be reconstructed?? Deschooling Society by Ivan Illich
    • ALT1:... that ...? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

5x expanded by MadisonLiggio (talk) and EmilycHingle (talk). Nominated by MadisonLiggio (talk) at 04:23, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 20

Herbert Vivian

Created by Railfan23 (talk). Self-nominated at 08:08, 22 November 2018 (UTC).

Cooperstown, New York

  • The sister city of Cooperstown is Windsor, Nova Scotia. Because Windsor is the birthplace of Ice Hockey and Cooperstown is the birthplace of Baseball.


Created/expanded by Bacardi379 (talk). Self-nominated at 13:51, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

@Daniel Case: can you assist me with this, its my first DYK just wanted to make sure all is right. Thanks Bacardi379 (talk) 14:00, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

@Bacardi379: Well, I don't see any evidence that it was recently expanded or promoted to GA, so it's ineligible. Daniel Case (talk) 20:09, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
@Daniel Case: What still needs to be done before it could become a GA?

Basil Cardew

  • ... that Basil Cardew, whose father was killed in a road accident, became one of the pre-eminent motoring journalists in Britain?
    • ALT1:... that British motoring journalist Basil Cardew, owned a camel hair coat, a "rakish trilby" hat, and was a "lavish spender of his paper's expenses"?
  • Reviewed: To be done

Created by Philafrenzy (talk) and Whispyhistory (talk). Nominated by Philafrenzy (talk) at 18:32, 21 November 2018 (UTC).

Encyclopedia of Camps and Ghettos, 1933–1945

  • ... that the editors of the Encyclopedia of Camps and Ghettos found that the Nazis had imprisoned and murdered people at 42,500 locations, far more than previously thought? Source: Van Pelt 2014, p. 150, [48]

5x expanded by Catrìona (talk). Self-nominated at 11:08, 21 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 21

Articles created/expanded on November 22

Go Mishima

  • ... that artist Go Mishima selected his pen name as a tribute to his friend, the writer Yukio Mishima? Source: Tom of Finland Foundation, Gallery Naruyama (in Japanese)

Created by Morgan695 (talk). Self-nominated at 05:05, 22 November 2018 (UTC).

Special occasion holding area

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