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@Falconjh: It is kind of rude to undo an explained good-faith change without an edit summary. MOS:LEAD#Pronunciation says that Do not include them for common English words with pronunciations that might be counterintuitive for learners (laughter, sword), along with general advice to indicate it only when not obvious. "Honey" is an everyday word whose pronunciation is well-known even to those who don't speak English. It's simply redundant and kind of lame to have it here, wikt:honey is thataway. No such user (talk) 14:52, 26 July 2017 (UTC)

Sorry, only laughter and sword don't have the IPA of the MOS examples of things not needing an IPA, and that section says "For more details on the formatting of pronunciation in the first sentence, see Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Pronunciation" which going to gives multiple examples that your link would suggest don't need it. Falconjh (talk) 15:25, 26 July 2017 (UTC)
OK, I see the guidelines might have some better cross-linking or repetition. I admit the MOS:LEAD is not the first place to look at, and I didn't reference it in my edit summary. No such user (talk) 15:29, 26 July 2017 (UTC)

Honey In Islam

I want to add to the religious significance of this article. I will reorganize the section into each religion and then focus on islam. I think more info can be added to the role of honey in islam, dishes that honey is used in, the medicinal value of honey in islam, and honey in the quran and hadiths.

These will be the sources i will use to get this information from

Altman, Nathaniel. "Healing Honey in Islam." The Honey Prescription: The Amazing Power of Honey as Medicine. N.p.: Healing Arts, 2010. 61-62. Print. Goldstein, Darra. "Islam." The Oxford Companion to Sugar and Sweets. N.p.: Oxford UP, 2015. 361. Print. Laudan, Rachel. "4. Islam Transforms the Cuisine of Central and West Asia, 800-1650 C.E." Cuisine and Empire: Cooking in World History. N.p.: U of California, 2015. N. pag. Print. Purbafrani, Abbasali, SeyedAmirhoseinb Ghazizade Hashemi, Saeed Bayyenat, Habibolah Taghizade Mogaddam, and Masumeh Saeidi. "The Benefits of Honey in Holy Quran." International Journal of Pediatrics 2 (n.d.): 67-73. Web. Roufs, Timothy G., and Kathleen Smyth. Roufs. Sweet Treats around the World. N.p.: ABC-CLIO, 2014. Print. Walvin, James. Sugar: The World Corrupted, from Slavery to Obesity. N.p.: Little, Brown Book Group, 2017. Print.Khatijajaffer (talk) 01:56, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

Any content that states or implies medical effects need supporting WP:MEDRS. Your first source looks very dodgy. Alexbrn (talk) 02:09, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

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Seeking Consensus on Medical uses

Hi Mean as custard, KH-1, and Flat Out,

I meant no offense and as far as I am aware I did not break the 3-revert rule. But, thank you Flat Out for explaining to me how to go about clearing up some miscommunications. At the moment, I am perplexed about why the content regarding using honey as a medical intervention in the case of button battery ingestions was eliminated from the section "Medical" on this page for two reasons: (1) a senior editor Zefr saw no problem with the inclusion and actually cleaned up the prose's verbosity, (2) it is a medical use as dictated by national guidelines and supported by a legitimate, highly publicized research study (see:altmetric attention score for publicity ranking amongst all 11+ million manuscripts ever tracked and the manuscript of the study for more information). I explained in detail why I was reverting the change to include this information -- it does not seem irrelevant or tangential, since it is a direct medical application of honey. Additionally, it is important for people to be aware of this new use for honey (which is officially recommended by the US-based Poison Control as originally cited, see:Poison Control Button Battery Ingestion Guideline), since it is not be an obvious one. I do not feel like my concerns are being addressed and if anything, I would appreciate if you would be clearer on your explain regarding its deletion.

Looking forward to hearing from you, --theraefactor (talk) 07:25, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

You don't have to break the 3 Revert Rule to edit war. I don't have a strong opinion on this edit, however I wonder why this particular medical reference was used when there have been many.Flat Out (talk) 07:29, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

Flat Out,

Thank for getting back to me so quickly. There are several medical uses already listed on the page - such as wounds and burns, antibiotic, cough, and others. And, this button battery ingestion one is noteworthy for a few reasons-

1. Pediatric button battery ingestions a major problem worldwide and can result in terrible outcomes including long term complications and death
2. there has never been an endorsed or recommended medical intervention that covers the period of time between a battery's ingestion and removal, making this a breakthrough
3. The fact that honey can be used increases the applicability and utility since honey is commonly found in the home, meaning a non-medical professional can begin prompt treatment -- making this use one that general population should know about
4. The study with the associated findings came across my facebook feed. As I looked into it further to check the validity of this treatment, I noticed the associated study received worldwide media coverage. According to Altmetric, a leading analytics company for assessing the weight of this publicity relative to other manuscript, it "has tracked 11,429,228 research outputs across all sources so far. Compared to these this one has done particularly well and is in the 99th percentile: it's in the top 5% of all research outputs ever tracked by Altmetric." I think this makes it noteworthy for inclusion in this page.
5. Additionally, the study seemed to have an immediate impact on the US national medical guideline for button battery ingestions that are followed and implemented in hospitals and clinical practices across the US.

So, while this might just be a use based off of one study, it already has garnered a lot of attention for the breakthrough nature of the intervention, its ease of use as a rapid intervention method that non-medical professional can implement, and its immediate clinical implementation via changes to national guidelines in the world's largest healthcare system. If this does not merit inclusion as a medical usage for honey, can you explain what does? Let me know what you think.

Thanks! theraefactor (talk) 07:54, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

I would suggest the following entry;
===Button cell Ingestion===
Honey has been recommended as an intervention for Button cell ingestions, to reduce the risk and severity of injury to the esophagus that can be caused by surgical retrieval of the battery.[1].[2]


  1. ^ "Button Battery Ingestion: Triage and Treatment Guideline". National Capital Poison Center, Washington, DC. June 2018. Retrieved 2018-07-05.
  2. ^ Anfang, Rachel R.; Jatana, Kris R.; Linn, Rebecca L.; Rhoades, Keith; Fry, Jared; Jacobs, Ian N. (2018-06-11). "pH-neutralizing esophageal irrigations as a novel mitigation strategy for button battery injury". The Laryngoscope. doi:10.1002/lary.27312. ISSN 0023-852X.

If anyone has any objections please reply. Flat Out (talk) 09:58, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

Hi Flat Out,
Thank you for the time and thought you put into this. I looked at your suggestion and I have small changes to make to it. Is this revision ok?
===Button cell Ingestion==
The use of honey has been recommended as a temporary intervention for known or suspected Button cell ingestions to reduce the risk and severity of injury to the esophagus caused by the battery prior to its removal. [1][2]


  1. ^ "Button Battery Ingestion: Triage and Treatment Guideline". National Capital Poison Center, Washington, DC. June 2018. Retrieved 2018-07-05.
  2. ^ Anfang, Rachel R.; Jatana, Kris R.; Linn, Rebecca L.; Rhoades, Keith; Fry, Jared; Jacobs, Ian N. (2018-06-11). "pH-neutralizing esophageal irrigations as a novel mitigation strategy for button battery injury". The Laryngoscope. doi:10.1002/lary.27312. ISSN 0023-852X.
This is more accurate of a statement since the injury is caused by the battery and not its removal.
theraefactor (talk) 10:10, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
Ive edited yours directly (we dont normally do this but im trying to help) to put honey up front and keep it simple, the reader can learn more from the sources. Im happy with this version Flat Out (talk) 10:17, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
Flat Out, I've made one more change to the version above to reflect the appropriate time period for the intervention. Does that make things to convoluted? Thank you for the help and guidance as I am new to wikipedia editing and learning my way through the process. theraefactor (talk) 10:29, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
OK you and I are in agreement, now we wait for other editors to have a say. If there is no further comment the edit can be made. Flat Out 10:41, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
The reason I reverted the original edit was because reference to button cell ingestion was too specific and trivial for a general article on honey. It might have a place in an article entitled "medical uses of honey", but not in this article. . . Mean as custard (talk) 10:48, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
Mean as custard Understood. However, an article specific to "medical uses of honey" does not exist from what I could find. And, this "honey" article does include a section for medical uses, so I thought it appropriate even if I was a bit too detailed. Also, I go into more detail above on why this is not a trivial mention. Do you mind looking at that explanation as well as the proposed change that Flat Out and I worked on and letting us know your opinion? --theraefactor (talk) 10:58, 6 July 2018 (UTC)


[64Cal currently cited in intro]. 1272kJ /100g => 46kCal for 15ml (assuming 15g) But a 20ml tablespoon is 61kCal.MBG02 (talk) 21:02, 7 July 2018 (UTC)

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